Just Remember WHAT QBs Won in Cleveland:
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@inspecta said:
I was actually being sarcastic.Quinn has started 3 games, you can't infer anything from his numbers, yet.
Anderson got fat on a weak ass schedule in 07. I'm not sure where you got those stats from, but do they have his percentage just from last year? That might be a more telling statistic. Sure the average is pretty good, but again we're talking about a guy who feasted on a bunch of winless and sub .500 teams. When we played real tough competition this year, he folded like a lawn chair.
So why didn't Quinn get fat on his weak ass schedule in '08?
He can't get fat against anybody but Navy apparently.
BTW, Anderson's TD% was 3.2 last year vs top competition, substantially higher than Quinn's vs weak competition.
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@inspecta said:
...Quinn has started 3 games, you can't infer anything from his numbers, yet...Bingo, bingo, bingo. Stats101.
We need the pre-season to start as we just don't have enough to do around here.
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@inspecta said:
Anderson shit the bed against top competition.what you don't even bother with the Giants caveat anymore? It hurts you to think one of the greatest games in franchise history was engineered last yr by DA, doesn't it?
And FYI, Quinn shit the bed against ALL competition.
Denver included.
We all know DA would have lit Denver up and posted the easy W.
And Buffalo with Trent Edwards tossing 3 first half picks in his own territory? Yeah let's take a wild guess and say Anderson wouldn't have settled for a total of 6 points.
Houston? I seem to remember a 10 point victory with DA at the helm. Not the same story when BQ went in was it?
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Just perused an article predicting the Browns season if Quinn were QB.
Quinn passes for 2,100 yards and 12 TDs. Total. For a whole season.
It also predicts that with BQ at the helm the Browns pull off a 3-13 record in '09.
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@inspecta said:
DA only shows up when there are 0 expectations on him.He's got 13 Ws as a starter and another one in relief.
in a good number of those wins, the browns were favored and expected to win. So he took care of business.
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@inspecta said:
Anderson shit the bed against top competition.what you don't even bother with the Giants caveat anymore? It hurts you to think one of the greatest games in franchise history was engineered last yr by DA, doesn't it?
And FYI, Quinn shit the bed against ALL competition.
Denver included.
We all know DA would have lit Denver up and posted the easy W.
And Buffalo with Trent Edwards tossing 3 first half picks in his own territory? Yeah let's take a wild guess and say Anderson wouldn't have settled for a total of 6 points.
Houston? I seem to remember a 10 point victory with DA at the helm. Not the same story when BQ went in was it?
what you don't even bother with the Giants caveat anymore? It hurts you to think one of the greatest games in franchise history was engineered last yr by DA, doesn't it?
Like I said, we're in the AFC and Dumb Ass hasn't beaten 1 AFC team with MORE than 8 wins in ANY game he has started. You can try like Hell to dream one up but you're gonna come up short like you always do.
In 06 - DA was 0-3 in his only 3 starts.
In 07 - DA beat ZERO AFC opponents that won MORE than 8 games
In 08 - DA beat ZERO AFC teams with MORE than 8 wins
Grand Total = Zero
Moral of the story: DA doesn't beat AFC teams thinking playoffs.
- Tom F.
I welcome the only Defensive Coordinator to earn a Superbowl Ring in New Orleans while understanding Revenge of the Nerds is a sequel. "Come get some!" -
what you don't even bother with the Giants caveat anymore? It hurts you to think one of the greatest games in franchise history was engineered last yr by DA, doesn't it?
Like I said, we're in the AFC and Dumb Ass hasn't beaten 1 AFC team with MORE than 8 wins in ANY game he has started. You can try like Hell to dream one up but you're gonna come up short like you always do.
In 06 - DA was 0-3 in his only 3 starts.
In 07 - DA beat ZERO AFC opponents that won MORE than 8 games
In 08 - DA beat ZERO AFC teams with MORE than 8 wins
Grand Total = Zero
Moral of the story: DA doesn't beat AFC teams thinking playoffs.
- Tom F.
Moral of the story: DA doesn't beat AFC teams thinking playoffs.
- Tom F.
I think the 2007 Buffalo Bills would beg to differ....
And a moral of a related story: Brady Quinn doesn't beat anybody. Including the Detroit Lions.
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what you don't even bother with the Giants caveat anymore? It hurts you to think one of the greatest games in franchise history was engineered last yr by DA, doesn't it?
Like I said, we're in the AFC and Dumb Ass hasn't beaten 1 AFC team with MORE than 8 wins in ANY game he has started. You can try like Hell to dream one up but you're gonna come up short like you always do.
In 06 - DA was 0-3 in his only 3 starts.
In 07 - DA beat ZERO AFC opponents that won MORE than 8 games
In 08 - DA beat ZERO AFC teams with MORE than 8 wins
Grand Total = Zero
Moral of the story: DA doesn't beat AFC teams thinking playoffs.
- Tom F.
j
Like I said, we're in the AFC and Dumb Ass hasn't beaten 1 AFC team with MORE than 8 wins in ANY game he has started. You can try like Hell to dream one up but you're gonna come up short like you always do.
In 06 - DA was 0-3 in his only 3 starts.
In 07 - DA beat ZERO AFC opponents that won MORE than 8 games
In 08 - DA beat ZERO AFC teams with MORE than 8 wins
Grand Total = Zero
Moral of the story: DA doesn't beat AFC teams thinking playoffs.
- Tom F.
you forgot to mention that the Browns sucked assets as a team & only won 4 games without DA in that 3 year span.
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TITANIC - My Heart Will Go On - Celine Dion----sing it Celine, sing it.
Every night in my dreams
I see you, I feel you
That is how I know you go on.
Far across the distance
and spaces between us
You have come to show you go on.
Near, Far,
wherever you are,
I believe that the heart does go on.
Once more, you opened the door
And you're here in my heart,
and my heart will go on and on.
Love can touch us one time
and last for a lifetime
And never let go till we're gone.
Love was when I loved you,
one true time to hold on to
In my life we'll always go on.
Near, far,
wherever you are,
I believe that the heart does go on.
Once more, you opened the door
And you're here in my heart,
and my heart will go on and on.
You're here, there's nothing I fear
And I know that my heart will go on.
We'll stay, forever this way
You are safe in my heart
and my heart will go on and on.
Tell me you don't tear up a little every time you hear this.............
-
j
Like I said, we're in the AFC and Dumb Ass hasn't beaten 1 AFC team with MORE than 8 wins in ANY game he has started. You can try like Hell to dream one up but you're gonna come up short like you always do.
In 06 - DA was 0-3 in his only 3 starts.
In 07 - DA beat ZERO AFC opponents that won MORE than 8 games
In 08 - DA beat ZERO AFC teams with MORE than 8 wins
Grand Total = Zero
Moral of the story: DA doesn't beat AFC teams thinking playoffs.
- Tom F.
you forgot to mention that the Browns sucked assets as a team & only won 4 games without DA in that 3 year span.
j
you forgot to mention that the Browns sucked assets as a team & only won 4 games without DA in that 3 year span.
That's the Dial-an-excuse way of looking at it.
ANOTHER way of looking at it is somebody continued to throw a GOLDEN opportunity in the trash can over a 3 year period. The great ones don't look back on excuses - they talk about how much fun they had gettin it done. How else do you explain 0% interest in DA when we made him available to the other 31 teams?
I don't care WHERE Dr Kevorkian went to college - I just don't want him running our offense any more. Sorry!
- Tom F.
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Flugel,
I think you make a good point about the "intellect" of the players we have faced in the likes of Elway and Plunkett and Montana etc.
I gone through this recently with fairly high achieving son who just graduated. (though NOT an athlete). In searching for colleges we were looking at highly rated academic institutions. Stanford, Notre Dame, Northwestern which you mention are among the TOP 25 ACADEMIC institutions in America and rate right up there with the Ivy League schools (Harvard, Yale, Princeton etc.), and the likes of MIT, Cal Tech, and some smaller profile (athletically) schools such as Williams, Smith, Amherst, Bowdoin, Grinnell, Pomona, Carleton, Bryn Mawr, Swarthmore, and a few Ohio schools like Oberlin, Kenyon,and Denison. (My son ended up choosing Kenyon though we looked at Notre Dame, Cornell, Oberlin).
The point being that you cannot underestimate the intellectual and academic requirements it takes to get accepted to these schools, and the likes of Stanford and Notre Dame, Duke etc. really do NOT make academic exceptions for athletes.
Sure, Stanford, Notre Dame, Duke etc. QBs can be busts in the NFL (see John Huarte and Rick Meier) but I believe they do start out with a certain advantage because of the quality of the education they received in college. Even Muck Fichigan is a top notch academic school, maybe having given the likes of Tom Brady certain advantages.
(and FYI, nearly all SEC schools are rated much poorer academically than Pac-10 or Big 10 or ACC schools...name a real quality SEC QB not named Manning in the NFL).
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Flugel,
I think you make a good point about the "intellect" of the players we have faced in the likes of Elway and Plunkett and Montana etc.
I gone through this recently with fairly high achieving son who just graduated. (though NOT an athlete). In searching for colleges we were looking at highly rated academic institutions. Stanford, Notre Dame, Northwestern which you mention are among the TOP 25 ACADEMIC institutions in America and rate right up there with the Ivy League schools (Harvard, Yale, Princeton etc.), and the likes of MIT, Cal Tech, and some smaller profile (athletically) schools such as Williams, Smith, Amherst, Bowdoin, Grinnell, Pomona, Carleton, Bryn Mawr, Swarthmore, and a few Ohio schools like Oberlin, Kenyon,and Denison. (My son ended up choosing Kenyon though we looked at Notre Dame, Cornell, Oberlin).
The point being that you cannot underestimate the intellectual and academic requirements it takes to get accepted to these schools, and the likes of Stanford and Notre Dame, Duke etc. really do NOT make academic exceptions for athletes.
Sure, Stanford, Notre Dame, Duke etc. QBs can be busts in the NFL (see John Huarte and Rick Meier) but I believe they do start out with a certain advantage because of the quality of the education they received in college. Even Muck Fichigan is a top notch academic school, maybe having given the likes of Tom Brady certain advantages.
(and FYI, nearly all SEC schools are rated much poorer academically than Pac-10 or Big 10 or ACC schools...name a real quality SEC QB not named Manning in the NFL).
Flugel,
I gone through this recently with fairly high achieving son who just graduated. (though NOT an athlete).
OK, this sentence is not indicative of my Akron U. education. Just my typing skills where my brain works faster than my fingers. Of course it should say "I have gone through this recently with a fairly high achieving son who just graduated"
OOPs
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To follow up on this intellectual capacity of QBs, Here is the US News and World Reports list of the best National Universities in America. (This list does not include the smaller liberal arts colleges like Kenyon, Amherst, Oberlin etc. that is on another list. Forbes rates them all together. Here I wanted to compare apples to apples and put just the major universities on here:
1. Harvard
2. Princeton
3. Yale
4. Stanford (Plunkett, Elway)
5. MIT
6. Cal Tech
7. Penn
8. Duke (Sonny Jurgenson)
9. Columbia
10. University of Chicago
11. Dartmouth
12. Northwestern (Otto Graham)
13. University of Washington in St. Louis
14. Cornell
15. John Hopkins
16. Brown
17. Rice (Frank Ryan)
18. Notre Dame (Montana, Quinn etc.)
19. Emory
20. Vanderbilt (Jay Cutler)
21. Cal-Berkely
22. Carnegie-Mellon
23. Georgetown
24. Virginia
25. Virginia
26. Michigan (Brady)
27. USC (Leinert, Palmer)
30. North Carolina
Wiconsin was 35, Illinois 40, Case 41, Penn St. 47, Texas 48, Florida 49, Miami, FLA. 51, Ohio St. 56
So you can see particularly Stanford rates up there. I mean, how many Ivy league QBs have done well in the league at any time? I don't know if you can think of any other Top notch QBs that went to these top schools.
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Flugel,
I think you make a good point about the "intellect" of the players we have faced in the likes of Elway and Plunkett and Montana etc.
I gone through this recently with fairly high achieving son who just graduated. (though NOT an athlete). In searching for colleges we were looking at highly rated academic institutions. Stanford, Notre Dame, Northwestern which you mention are among the TOP 25 ACADEMIC institutions in America and rate right up there with the Ivy League schools (Harvard, Yale, Princeton etc.), and the likes of MIT, Cal Tech, and some smaller profile (athletically) schools such as Williams, Smith, Amherst, Bowdoin, Grinnell, Pomona, Carleton, Bryn Mawr, Swarthmore, and a few Ohio schools like Oberlin, Kenyon,and Denison. (My son ended up choosing Kenyon though we looked at Notre Dame, Cornell, Oberlin).
The point being that you cannot underestimate the intellectual and academic requirements it takes to get accepted to these schools, and the likes of Stanford and Notre Dame, Duke etc. really do NOT make academic exceptions for athletes.
Sure, Stanford, Notre Dame, Duke etc. QBs can be busts in the NFL (see John Huarte and Rick Meier) but I believe they do start out with a certain advantage because of the quality of the education they received in college. Even Muck Fichigan is a top notch academic school, maybe having given the likes of Tom Brady certain advantages.
(and FYI, nearly all SEC schools are rated much poorer academically than Pac-10 or Big 10 or ACC schools...name a real quality SEC QB not named Manning in the NFL).
Flugel,
I think you make a good point about the "intellect" of the players we have faced in the likes of Elway and Plunkett and Montana etc.
I gone through this recently with fairly high achieving son who just graduated. (though NOT an athlete). In searching for colleges we were looking at highly rated academic institutions. Stanford, Notre Dame, Northwestern which you mention are among the TOP 25 ACADEMIC institutions in America and rate right up there with the Ivy League schools (Harvard, Yale, Princeton etc.), and the likes of MIT, Cal Tech, and some smaller profile (athletically) schools such as Williams, Smith, Amherst, Bowdoin, Grinnell, Pomona, Carleton, Bryn Mawr, Swarthmore, and a few Ohio schools like Oberlin, Kenyon,and Denison. (My son ended up choosing Kenyon though we looked at Notre Dame, Cornell, Oberlin).
The point being that you cannot underestimate the intellectual and academic requirements it takes to get accepted to these schools, and the likes of Stanford and Notre Dame, Duke etc. really do NOT make academic exceptions for athletes.
Sure, Stanford, Notre Dame, Duke etc. QBs can be busts in the NFL (see John Huarte and Rick Meier) but I believe they do start out with a certain advantage because of the quality of the education they received in college. Even Muck Fichigan is a top notch academic school, maybe having given the likes of Tom Brady certain advantages.
(and FYI, nearly all SEC schools are rated much poorer academically than Pac-10 or Big 10 or ACC schools...name a real quality SEC QB not named Manning in the NFL).
VERY interesting stuff Gipper! Thanks man! You definitely want a smart guy QBing the offense.
Otto Graham went to Northwestern and the SMART leadership rubbed off on the team.
I remembered reading about HOW SMART Bernie Kosar was academically back when he was in college. He led the VERY first National Championship run at that school before leading us to 3 straight Conference Championship appearances.
Elway & Plunkett were mentioned for the intelligence quotients.
Montana and Theisman were smart fellers.
Brees is intelligent. Both Mannings are smart.
Quinn was just as good at academics as he was football.
I welcome intelligence back to our QB position. We won't win until Quinn gets named starter.
- Tom F.
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Flugel,
I think you make a good point about the "intellect" of the players we have faced in the likes of Elway and Plunkett and Montana etc.
I gone through this recently with fairly high achieving son who just graduated. (though NOT an athlete). In searching for colleges we were looking at highly rated academic institutions. Stanford, Notre Dame, Northwestern which you mention are among the TOP 25 ACADEMIC institutions in America and rate right up there with the Ivy League schools (Harvard, Yale, Princeton etc.), and the likes of MIT, Cal Tech, and some smaller profile (athletically) schools such as Williams, Smith, Amherst, Bowdoin, Grinnell, Pomona, Carleton, Bryn Mawr, Swarthmore, and a few Ohio schools like Oberlin, Kenyon,and Denison. (My son ended up choosing Kenyon though we looked at Notre Dame, Cornell, Oberlin).
The point being that you cannot underestimate the intellectual and academic requirements it takes to get accepted to these schools, and the likes of Stanford and Notre Dame, Duke etc. really do NOT make academic exceptions for athletes.
Sure, Stanford, Notre Dame, Duke etc. QBs can be busts in the NFL (see John Huarte and Rick Meier) but I believe they do start out with a certain advantage because of the quality of the education they received in college. Even Muck Fichigan is a top notch academic school, maybe having given the likes of Tom Brady certain advantages.
(and FYI, nearly all SEC schools are rated much poorer academically than Pac-10 or Big 10 or ACC schools...name a real quality SEC QB not named Manning in the NFL).
VERY interesting stuff Gipper! Thanks man! You definitely want a smart guy QBing the offense.
Otto Graham went to Northwestern and the SMART leadership rubbed off on the team.
I remembered reading about HOW SMART Bernie Kosar was academically back when he was in college. He led the VERY first National Championship run at that school before leading us to 3 straight Conference Championship appearances.
Elway & Plunkett were mentioned for the intelligence quotients.
Montana and Theisman were smart fellers.
Brees is intelligent. Both Mannings are smart.
Quinn was just as good at academics as he was football.
I welcome intelligence back to our QB position. We won't win until Quinn gets named starter.
- Tom F.
Quinn was just as good at academics as he was football.
Says who? Quinn only got a 1030 on the SAT. That doesn't get a non-football player into Notre Dame.
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@inspecta said:
Gipper, I think you partly explained that phenomena in a previous post.Those schools don't make exceptions for athletes, and the schools themselves never really valued their athletic dept like other schools have. They don't generate the kind of money the Florida's, Miami's and Texas's of the world.
So the top athletes who are also smart have to have a desire to attend these academic schools. Any QB who has a serious shot at making the NFL would willingly chose to go to an Ivy league school. They want a big school with big exposure and a good team around them to ensure success.
That's the main reason I believe the smarter athletes don't chose to go to an Ivy league school, that and the funding to attend said school just isn't there because the football scholarships don't offer full rides, and lets face it, unless your last name is Hilton or Rockefeller or Trump chances are your parents can't afford to send you to those schools.
Well, honestly, I probably only make around 50K per year, yet I am sending my son to Kenyon which is one of the 5 most expensive schools in America. Yet, bottom line it is going to cost less for me to send him there than to say Akron U. because of the grants, scholarships and endowments he is going to receive. That proves the quality of that school in taking and helping out the best students regardless of financial ability. I understand the Ivies are similar.
But of course it is still not the same as getting a full ride athletic scholarship at a big time athletic school. Those athletes parents are not going to be out of pocket at all. Plus you have no clue how many $50.00 handshakes those recruited athletes may get. My son isn't going to get any $50.00 handshakes.
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Says who? Quinn only got a 1030 on the SAT. That doesn't get a non-football player into Notre Dame.
No, not normally, but SAT scores alone are not the only criteria.
They obviously give weight to GPA and extracurriculars etc.
Let's just say that Brady had some "extracurriculars" that got him ahead.
My son had a 1300 SAT and a 32 ACT. But he also had some extracurriculars (non athletic) that gave him a boost.
Eagle Scout, Foreign Language scholar.
OK, being a top notch high school QB could rate up there with being an Eagle scout, no?
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In checking, the averages for students admitted to Notre Dame were a 3.77 GPA, a 32 ACT, and a 1382 SAT.
I don't know if these averages include all the scholar athletes for football etc. that were admitted. I suspect they do.
(My son had a 3.76 GPA and a 32 and a 1300...but though we intitially considered that school he early on crossed it off as he was opposed to the "major sports profile" that the school had though in many other respects it fit his criteria fairly nicely.
What were Quinn's other numbers?
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