Vernon traded to Browns In Exchange For Kevin Zeitler
-
Well had all afternoon to stew on this.. Losing a quality OL really had me worried(still does).. Baker needs the best protection we can afford to buy for him.. BUT GOD DAMN, watching the film on Vernon has be fucking salivating...
This isn't a knock on Garret(well maybe), but he tends to be a one trick pony. He is super fast trying to get around the OL, and is very good at that, but more times than not, the QB just steps inside and its for nothing...
Watching that video of Vernon has me envisioning the QB being forced inside lest Garret strips him or sacks his ass, but then you got Vernon who seems to have next level hands and inside moves and bull rushes that Garret has yet to show.. Imagine Garrent flying around the outside and pushing the runner/QB back inside, where last year they ate us alive.
Vernon seems to sense better where the play is going, whereas Garret is one minded in what he is doing(the going around the edge thing he does). Vernon from the film I've seen looks like a person who understands the playbook. Like Shoebert or Baker, he knows where the play is going and seems to anticipate instead of reacting... This could be so good for us.. Someone who can work the outside but not get caught out there while the play goes inside. He seems to be able to do both.
And hopefully that can rub off on Garret who needs a few more tricks up his sleeve.
BobPound
-
Strongly disagree. He still has another big payday after these 2 years. And it probably won’t be as a Brown.
We'll worry about that in 2021....
This was our big move to help shore up the LDE spot? a 28 yr old going on his 3rd contract? I wanna hear that Ansah and Flowers were approached but either didn't want to come to Clev or wanted too much. And yeah, giving up an OL just when our OL started to gel? another head scratcher.
You're the only one around here who was banging the drum for Ansah. Ziggy and Vernon are almost exactly the same age. Take it to the bank Ansah is going to want a contract for more than two years, and probably more guaranteed than the $30 million we're on the hook for Vernon. Yeah, he's probably a better player than Vernon when healthy. He wasn't last year, and you can bet Dorsey took that into consideration.
-
This may also mean interior DL isn't a given in the first. Can ogbah play inside, given his runD skill?
We may still pick DT at the 1, but it's more interesting.
-
While clearly tentative discussion had to have been going on for a while, I think the Texans tagging Clowney prompted pulling the trigger on this alternative.
Good deal? Yes, provided VO stays healthy... or at least healthier than he's been the past two seasons.
As for the OL concerns some have posted. Dorsey ain't gettin' Baker killed so at least he has confidence that Corbett is ready. In fact Austin likely would have played well last season had he been given the chance.
That said... will there be an OG fall-off? Absolutely... Zeit posted a great year... arguably his best... but to trade into a little fall-off at OG to set MG up for a BIG year is a deal all should welcome.
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
I'll take this deal over the rumored OBJ deal 100/100 times. Giving up Zietler is tough, but
1) Corbett should be much better going into year 2
2) This draft is extremely deep in OL. The browns could still draft more lineman
3) Vernon switched to a 3-4 last year and did not get to put his hand in the ground as much and he still dominated
4) The whole goal of FA is to supplement your team so when the draft comes around you take BPA. That is exactly what the browns are doing.
5) They were still able to move up almost 20 spots in the draft. That is more firepower.
I think Dorsey is going to create some fireworks on draft day to get his interior DL. If Oliver falls into the 10-12 range, watch out.
-
Well had all afternoon to stew on this.. Losing a quality OL really had me worried(still does).. Baker needs the best protection we can afford to buy for him.. BUT GOD DAMN, watching the film on Vernon has be fucking salivating...
This isn't a knock on Garret(well maybe), but he tends to be a one trick pony. He is super fast trying to get around the OL, and is very good at that, but more times than not, the QB just steps inside and its for nothing...
Watching that video of Vernon has me envisioning the QB being forced inside lest Garret strips him or sacks his ass, but then you got Vernon who seems to have next level hands and inside moves and bull rushes that Garret has yet to show.. Imagine Garrent flying around the outside and pushing the runner/QB back inside, where last year they ate us alive.
Vernon seems to sense better where the play is going, whereas Garret is one minded in what he is doing(the going around the edge thing he does). Vernon from the film I've seen looks like a person who understands the playbook. Like Shoebert or Baker, he knows where the play is going and seems to anticipate instead of reacting... This could be so good for us.. Someone who can work the outside but not get caught out there while the play goes inside. He seems to be able to do both.
And hopefully that can rub off on Garret who needs a few more tricks up his sleeve.
BobPound
Well had all afternoon to stew on this.. Losing a quality OL really had me worried(still does).. Baker needs the best protection we can afford to buy for him.. BUT GOD DAMN, watching the film on Vernon has be fucking salivating...
This isn't a knock on Garret(well maybe), but he tends to be a one trick pony. He is super fast trying to get around the OL, and is very good at that, but more times than not, the QB just steps inside and its for nothing...
Watching that video of Vernon has me envisioning the QB being forced inside lest Garret strips him or sacks his ass, but then you got Vernon who seems to have next level hands and inside moves and bull rushes that Garret has yet to show.. Imagine Garrent flying around the outside and pushing the runner/QB back inside, where last year they ate us alive.
Vernon seems to sense better where the play is going, whereas Garret is one minded in what he is doing(the going around the edge thing he does). Vernon from the film I've seen looks like a person who understands the playbook. Like Shoebert or Baker, he knows where the play is going and seems to anticipate instead of reacting... This could be so good for us.. Someone who can work the outside but not get caught out there while the play goes inside. He seems to be able to do both.
And hopefully that can rub off on Garret who needs a few more tricks up his sleeve.
BobPound
im not sure you're watching Garrett very closely. His "toolset" is already elite. They lined him up as the 5 tech a lot this season which means in our 34 packages he was lining up between guard and tackle...and not just took them on but often broke through. His bullrush is prob right now better than most of the top FA's at his position. Maybe only Flowers and Ansah are comparable in straight line power.
-
I'd like to hear tho that Flowers was approached and that was just a no go. Either he didn't want to come here at all or wanted too much money. Flowers and Garrett, I mean my god...and Flowers is a regular LDE. Vernon looks like he comes off Garretts side on all of his highlights. Not seen a single rush attempt in any vid from the LDE spot.
-
-
Zietler and Bito pair to form one of the best pass pro interiors in the NFL.
Vernon is on the downside of his career.
Not feeling this.
depending on one's opinion of PFF...
https://www.profootballfocus.com/news/pro-giants-browns-both-win-in-blockbuster-vernon-zeitler-trade
still productive regardless of where his is in his career arc
depending on one's opinion of PFF...
https://www.profootballfocus.com/news/pro-giants-browns-both-win-in-blockbuster-vernon-zeitler-trade
still productive regardless of where his is in his career arc
PFF loves the Browns. Guy who grades as a top 10 OL multiple times is swapped for a guy who has never broken the top 10 in DL and that's a win for the Browns...must be common core math.
Baker needs all the help he can get but time will tell
-
I like the move. Vernon is quality & he returns to a 4-3 D. As far as OL goes, remember that we have james Campen as OL line coach. Not only is he VERY experienced & successful, but you can bet he has watched a ton of film since coming aboard & is well aware of Corbett's readiness.
Again, I have tremendous faith in Dorsey & his F/O staff.
Mike
-
I’m seeing some positive things about Corbett here and there. Just random musings about how strong he is and how he played out of position at tackle.
I think people would take him more seriously as a lineman if he didn’t have such a baby face. I mean, look at those cheeks! Don’t ya just wanna pinch ‘em? Grow some scruff man!
-
Just wait until they add Suh on the interior. We are going to be FEARED
-
Just wait until they add Suh on the interior. We are going to be FEARED
Not saying id be against that, just dont see it happenin. I don't think suhs leaving LA. I think Dorsey decided to use a trade to as address LDE and will look to use our FA cap on an offensive weapon. DT will probably be drafted.
But who knows maybe I'm wrong. I honestly expected the big FA signing to address the LDE primarily and maybe DT as well. I would have preferred the combo of ansah and hunt to vernon, in place of giving up zeitler. I like vernon, but giving up a see solid OL piece on a team with historically bad ol's is iffy to me.
I know a lot of people didn't car e for him but Shelton was an interior space eater, biggest reason why 2 seasons ago we were #6 against the run. The zeitler trade feels similar to me, with zeitler being maybe even more important now because of #6. Some People say ahhh it's just a guard. We can pull any ole fatass off the street to protect Baker.
-
Just wait until they add Suh on the interior. We are going to be FEARED
Not saying id be against that, just dont see it happenin. I don't think suhs leaving LA. I think Dorsey decided to use a trade to as address LDE and will look to use our FA cap on an offensive weapon. DT will probably be drafted.
But who knows maybe I'm wrong. I honestly expected the big FA signing to address the LDE primarily and maybe DT as well. I would have preferred the combo of ansah and hunt to vernon, in place of giving up zeitler. I like vernon, but giving up a see solid OL piece on a team with historically bad ol's is iffy to me.
I know a lot of people didn't car e for him but Shelton was an interior space eater, biggest reason why 2 seasons ago we were #6 against the run. The zeitler trade feels similar to me, with zeitler being maybe even more important now because of #6. Some People say ahhh it's just a guard. We can pull any ole fatass off the street to protect Baker.
Not saying id be against that, just dont see it happenin. I don't think suhs leaving LA. I think Dorsey decided to use a trade to as address LDE and will look to use our FA cap on an offensive weapon. DT will probably be drafted.
But who knows maybe I'm wrong. I honestly expected the big FA signing to address the LDE primarily and maybe DT as well. I would have preferred the combo of ansah and hunt to vernon, in place of giving up zeitler. I like vernon, but giving up a see solid OL piece on a team with historically bad ol's is iffy to me.
I know a lot of people didn't car e for him but Shelton was an interior space eater, biggest reason why 2 seasons ago we were #6 against the run. The zeitler trade feels similar to me, with zeitler being maybe even more important now because of #6. Some People say ahhh it's just a guard. We can pull any ole fatass off the street to protect Baker.
By some people, you mean Ghoolie.
-
Not saying id be against that, just dont see it happenin. I don't think suhs leaving LA. I think Dorsey decided to use a trade to as address LDE and will look to use our FA cap on an offensive weapon. DT will probably be drafted.
But who knows maybe I'm wrong. I honestly expected the big FA signing to address the LDE primarily and maybe DT as well. I would have preferred the combo of ansah and hunt to vernon, in place of giving up zeitler. I like vernon, but giving up a see solid OL piece on a team with historically bad ol's is iffy to me.
I know a lot of people didn't car e for him but Shelton was an interior space eater, biggest reason why 2 seasons ago we were #6 against the run. The zeitler trade feels similar to me, with zeitler being maybe even more important now because of #6. Some People say ahhh it's just a guard. We can pull any ole fatass off the street to protect Baker.
By some people, you mean Ghoolie.
By some people, you mean Ghoolie.
??
-
I'll pull a Canton Mike here and say "We'll see".
I like adding talent in the Dline, but OV has been suffering injuries last two years and as someone said earlier he usually starts from RDE position, the same as Garrett. I'd be more comfortable if he usually played LDE so we would already know for sure that we could play him and MG at the same time.
I think that Corbett MUST be able to step up and play. Maybe not at Zeitler's level, but certainly at a good level considering the draft pick he was taken with. I like him playing as a guard and not waiting on him to learn how to play another position in the pros.
I hope we are not messing up the OL too much and we can improve rushing opposite QBs. Adding someone like Vernon in the DL rotation instantly adds some quality depth and I think both Garrett and Ogbah will use that.
And I prefer this instead of a huge firework-cap space nightmare FA signing.
-
Well here is a novel thought. What about playing him at RDE, Ogbah stays at LDE and move Garrett into a DT spot right next to Ogujobi? There were multiple plays last year when Garrett switched to DT and was an absolute nightmare for the C & G, constantly splitting them and forcing early throws, stopped runs and even a sack/flush or two. Think about it. If Garrett is right next to Ogbah, don't you think the combined sack total and run stopping goes up between those two and Vernon combined that way?
-
While clearly tentative discussion had to have been going on for a while, I think the Texans tagging Clowney prompted pulling the trigger on this alternative.
Good deal? Yes, provided VO stays healthy... or at least healthier than he's been the past two seasons.
As for the OL concerns some have posted. Dorsey ain't gettin' Baker killed so at least he has confidence that Corbett is ready. In fact Austin likely would have played well last season had he been given the chance.
That said... will there be an OG fall-off? Absolutely... Zeit posted a great year... arguably his best... but to trade into a little fall-off at OG to set MG up for a BIG year is a deal all should welcome.
As for the OL concerns some have posted. Dorsey ain't gettin' Baker killed so at least he has confidence that Corbett is ready. In fact Austin likely would have played well last season had he been given the chance.
That said... will there be an OG fall-off? Absolutely... Zeit posted a great year... arguably his best... but to trade into a little fall-off at OG to set MG up for a BIG year is a deal all should welcome.
Sign FA G/C Mitch Morse please..no sacks in over 1500 snaps & dorsey drafted him..make Corbett earn it. am so tired of watching high drafted handouts sitting on cap space..Easy targets on Hubbard/Corbett coming soon & Tretter is no spring chicken.. EDit--those looking for OV at both DE's? need to watch more ACC football
..Look at The U in Miami OV highlights..Am still a little stunned Dorsey made this move due to comparing injury historys .. but OV has played with his hair on fire ?since college..a big time motor guy to add to our rotation..big wingspan right at Big Ben's eyeballs..Big Z your going to be missed in my book..Good career start in Cinn. followed to the Browns..Pro bowls await blocking with S.Barkley? Good Luck, Big Z!!
Browns & Buffett: Got to go fishin, Down to rock bottom again, with just a few Friends
Hello! It looks like you're interested in this conversation, but you don't have an account yet.
Getting fed up of having to scroll through the same posts each visit? When you register for an account, you'll always come back to exactly where you were before, and choose to be notified of new replies (either via email, or push notification). You'll also be able to save bookmarks and upvote posts to show your appreciation to other community members.
With your input, this post could be even better 💗
Register Login