Jonathan Paul Manziel
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Derek Carr is going to need you to stay outside of the legally specified 300 ft, Poetic.
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I've never actively wished for a player to succeed solely to prove someone wrong, but I'm honestly starting to lean toward that way of thinking regarding Manziel.
It's nothing but the same ill-informed dreck from the same people over and over again. There are literally only three people who even attempt to make rational scouting conversation and that actually do their own analysis. The rest is just recycled, misquoted bullshit from ESPN that, honestly, doesn't even belong in conversation.
so you're siding with kiper and all the other mis-informed dregs that consider manziel #1 goods? so instead of being in the minority you are now in the majority.
hey i hope the kid does do good. and if we draft him (like we did TR, weeden and mccoy) i'll root for them even though i thought at the time what a dumb move.
meanwhile i don't know what agent he signed with but whoever it is needs to tell the kid to shut the fuck up. watching olberman tonite and now i've seen where he has said that if jacksonville passes on him it will be "the biggest mistake of their lives, because i'll make sure they will have regretted that decision each and everytime we play them."
what a cunt. i DON'T root for assholes like that unless of course they are on my team.
that kid wouldn't last a season in cleveland IMHO, begging the differences of such acclaimed football analysis fans on this forum such as MIKE H, TCPO, WALTER WHITE, CLEVEANDMILK AND JEFFINPODUNKLAND.
call me when you wanna make that bet guys.
so you're siding with kiper and all the other mis-informed dregs that consider manziel #1 goods? so instead of being in the minority you are now in the majority.
hey i hope the kid does do good. and if we draft him (like we did TR, weeden and mccoy) i'll root for them even though i thought at the time what a dumb move.
meanwhile i don't know what agent he signed with but whoever it is needs to tell the kid to shut the fuck up. watching olberman tonite and now i've seen where he has said that if jacksonville passes on him it will be "the biggest mistake of their lives, because i'll make sure they will have regretted that decision each and everytime we play them."
what a cunt. i DON'T root for assholes like that unless of course they are on my team.
that kid wouldn't last a season in cleveland IMHO, begging the differences of such acclaimed football analysis fans on this forum such as MIKE H, TCPO, WALTER WHITE, CLEVEANDMILK AND JEFFINPODUNKLAND.
call me when you wanna make that bet guys.
I never said that I thought he's a #1 overall.
What I said is that people on here are judging him based on reading others scouting reports and don't do their own research.
I don't know what bet you're talking about but I'm willing to wager that he'll win more games for Houston if they get him than we win if we don't.
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Im willing to bet Manziel has the best career of any QB prospect in this draft.
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XxDaBuckeyexX said:
Im willing to bet Manziel has the best career of any QB prospect in this draft.
Right on.
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my bet was he doesn't throw at the combine.
any six pack of fine beer.
period.
he won't because he doesn't have the balls.
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XxDaBuckeyexX said:
Im willing to bet Manziel has the best career of any QB prospect in this draft.
in what period of time before he gets pummeled? his first year starting? second?
let's get specific now.
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my bet was he doesn't throw at the combine.
any six pack of fine beer.
period.
he won't because he doesn't have the balls.
my bet was he doesn't throw at the combine.
any six pack of fine beer.
period.
he won't because he doesn't have the balls.
His agent already said he wouldn't, do you have the balls to make a bet thats not already predetermined.
1st Ezekiel Ansah, DE, BYU 3rd Darius Slay, CB, Mississippi State4th Landry Jones, QB, Oklahoma5th Earl Wolff, S, N.C. State6th Lucas Reed, TE, New Mexico -
No combine for Johnny Streetball and a couple others whining cause they don't have their security blanket receivers.
well no throwing i mean
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I have watched a lot more Manziel footage. Has happy feet, doesn't read defenses well, lobs passes up and hopes that his receivers bail him out (Evans did that quite a lot). Will he develop into a good QB? Anything is possible. Right now he is not worth a top 10 pick. He won't be able to use his athleticism to save him from a bad read in the pros. Vick was a better athlete and still got smashed.
I have watched a lot more Manziel footage. Has happy feet, doesn't read defenses well, lobs passes up and hopes that his receivers bail him out (Evans did that quite a lot). Will he develop into a good QB? Anything is possible. Right now he is not worth a top 10 pick. He won't be able to use his athleticism to save him from a bad read in the pros. Vick was a better athlete and still got smashed.
I totally agree
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my bet was he doesn't throw at the combine.
any six pack of fine beer.
period.
he won't because he doesn't have the balls.
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His agent already said he wouldn't, do you have the balls to make a bet thats not already predetermined.
Umm I do. I will bet you that Manziel is not drafted by Cleveland OR if he is he posts are record under .500 year 1
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His agent already said he wouldn't, do you have the balls to make a bet thats not already predetermined.
Umm I do. I will bet you that Manziel is not drafted by Cleveland OR if he is he posts are record under .500 year 1
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@mike-h said:
I'll bet you 100$ he doesn't throw at the combine.
hey! you can't over-reach on the same bet.........that's like bizarro world or some shit.
so when carr or fales or garroppolo (sp?) do throw and shine like a crazy diamond, what does that do to the draft value of the top 3?
hey! you can't over-reach on the same bet.........that's like bizarro world or some shit.
so when carr or fales or garroppolo (sp?) do throw and shine like a crazy diamond, what does that do to the draft value of the top 3?
It does nothing to the value of the top 3. They're the top 3 for a reason.
A strong Combine performance will certainly boost the stock of the "undesirables", as I like to call them, but it won't do anything to affect Bridgewater, Bortles or Manziel.
Fales, Garopollo and Carr could be perfect in the Combine, but it doesn't change the fact that they played against bottom barrel talent for the entirety of their careers. It also won't change the fact that Carr's numbers were the product of a system offense that has never had any sort of success in the NFL, or that Fales and Garopollo lack elite arm strength.
Each has their own advantages. For Carr, it's his physical attributes. For Garopollo, it's his quick release. For Fales, it's his ball placement and anticipation throws. But they've yet to do anything on a big stage, and the NFL Draft history books are full of smaller name quarterbacks with a few great qualities that did nothing with their careers.
A good Combine performance will certainly improve their stock. We might even see Garopollo pull a Ponder and crack the first round. But to think that it will, in any way, ruin the stock of the Big 3 is just absurd.
I'm awesome, and I fuck dolphins. Ghoolie 12/2/2012: I have absolutely no skills, training or pride -
Just for shits and giggles everybody watch Manziels last College football game and count how many times he gets "happy feet" against a phantom pass rush and mark down the time it happens in the video then mark down every time he stands in the pocket and makes his reads. I'm interested in what your seeing.
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hey! you can't over-reach on the same bet.........that's like bizarro world or some shit.
so when carr or fales or garroppolo (sp?) do throw and shine like a crazy diamond, what does that do to the draft value of the top 3?
It does nothing to the value of the top 3. They're the top 3 for a reason.
A strong Combine performance will certainly boost the stock of the "undesirables", as I like to call them, but it won't do anything to affect Bridgewater, Bortles or Manziel.
Fales, Garopollo and Carr could be perfect in the Combine, but it doesn't change the fact that they played against bottom barrel talent for the entirety of their careers. It also won't change the fact that Carr's numbers were the product of a system offense that has never had any sort of success in the NFL, or that Fales and Garopollo lack elite arm strength.
Each has their own advantages. For Carr, it's his physical attributes. For Garopollo, it's his quick release. For Fales, it's his ball placement and anticipation throws. But they've yet to do anything on a big stage, and the NFL Draft history books are full of smaller name quarterbacks with a few great qualities that did nothing with their careers.
A good Combine performance will certainly improve their stock. We might even see Garopollo pull a Ponder and crack the first round. But to think that it will, in any way, ruin the stock of the Big 3 is just absurd.
It does nothing to the value of the top 3. They're the top 3 for a reason.
A strong Combine performance will certainly boost the stock of the "undesirables", as I like to call them, but it won't do anything to affect Bridgewater, Bortles or Manziel.
Fales, Garopollo and Carr could be perfect in the Combine, but it doesn't change the fact that they played against bottom barrel talent for the entirety of their careers. It also won't change the fact that Carr's numbers were the product of a system offense that has never had any sort of success in the NFL, or that Fales and Garopollo lack elite arm strength.
Each has their own advantages. For Carr, it's his physical attributes. For Garopollo, it's his quick release. For Fales, it's his ball placement and anticipation throws. But they've yet to do anything on a big stage, and the NFL Draft history books are full of smaller name quarterbacks with a few great qualities that did nothing with their careers.
A good Combine performance will certainly improve their stock. We might even see Garopollo pull a Ponder and crack the first round. But to think that it will, in any way, ruin the stock of the Big 3 is just absurd.
All fair points TCPO. The only thing I would say as a counter however is that the NFL history books are also pretty full of big name high draft guys that were also busts. At the end of the day its part science and part luck I think. From 1990 forward major first round (mostly high first round) disappointments include:
Mark Sanchez, Jamarcus Russel, Vince Young , Matt Leinart, Byron Leftwich, David Carr, Joey Harrington, Tim Couch, Akili Smith, Cade McNown, Ryan Leaf, Heath Shuler, Rick Mirer, David Klingler, Andre Ware.
I know that's not a huge list spanning 24 years but it does indicate that things aren't always as good as they look,Lets hope this year we get it right wherever we decide to take one.
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It does nothing to the value of the top 3. They're the top 3 for a reason.
A strong Combine performance will certainly boost the stock of the "undesirables", as I like to call them, but it won't do anything to affect Bridgewater, Bortles or Manziel.
Fales, Garopollo and Carr could be perfect in the Combine, but it doesn't change the fact that they played against bottom barrel talent for the entirety of their careers. It also won't change the fact that Carr's numbers were the product of a system offense that has never had any sort of success in the NFL, or that Fales and Garopollo lack elite arm strength.
Each has their own advantages. For Carr, it's his physical attributes. For Garopollo, it's his quick release. For Fales, it's his ball placement and anticipation throws. But they've yet to do anything on a big stage, and the NFL Draft history books are full of smaller name quarterbacks with a few great qualities that did nothing with their careers.
A good Combine performance will certainly improve their stock. We might even see Garopollo pull a Ponder and crack the first round. But to think that it will, in any way, ruin the stock of the Big 3 is just absurd.
All fair points TCPO. The only thing I would say as a counter however is that the NFL history books are also pretty full of big name high draft guys that were also busts. At the end of the day its part science and part luck I think. From 1990 forward major first round (mostly high first round) disappointments include:
Mark Sanchez, Jamarcus Russel, Vince Young , Matt Leinart, Byron Leftwich, David Carr, Joey Harrington, Tim Couch, Akili Smith, Cade McNown, Ryan Leaf, Heath Shuler, Rick Mirer, David Klingler, Andre Ware.
I know that's not a huge list spanning 24 years but it does indicate that things aren't always as good as they look,Lets hope this year we get it right wherever we decide to take one.
All fair points TCPO. The only thing I would say as a counter however is that the NFL history books are also pretty full of big name high draft guys that were also busts. At the end of the day its part science and part luck I think. From 1990 forward major first round (mostly high first round) disappointments include:
Mark Sanchez, Jamarcus Russel, Vince Young , Matt Leinart, Byron Leftwich, David Carr, Joey Harrington, Tim Couch, Akili Smith, Cade McNown, Ryan Leaf, Heath Shuler, Rick Mirer, David Klingler, Andre Ware.
I know that's not a huge list spanning 24 years but it does indicate that things aren't always as good as they look,Lets hope this year we get it right wherever we decide to take one.
That's a fair point, but I'd make the claim that the big name bust list is nowhere near the list of mid round small school prospect bust list.
Big name prospects from big name programs can be just as bad as someone from anywhere else, I agree. But in a game of odds such as drafting, taking a guy who's routinely made plays against better competition is just a higher percentage play.
In the end, however, it comes down to scheme fit.
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