Trade for Khalil Mack
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thays fine but if he bitches then that tge raiders dont play meaningful games in december cause theres not enough talent around him......
thays fine but if he bitches then that tge raiders dont play meaningful games in december cause theres not enough talent around him......
I think we have much more overall talent than Oakland now
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Hey fellas, long time no post.
This is one of those things I have said in the past that just is a pet peeve to me.
"I wouldn't trade x pick for him, look at what we COULD get." True. Could get a great player, or could get Gilbert. Maybe not at 8, but it's not like Gilbert was going to be a low pick, he still would have been a 1st rounder. I did see him as a bust because of his skills, but that is beside the point.
Mack IS PROVEN. As in Defensive Player of the year proven.
I am not talking about the guys who are saying something about his salary, even though you get what you pay for, again DEFENSIVE PLAYER OF THE YEAR.
I'm talking about people who cover picks more than proven. If Mack were in the past draft with his tape from NFL, it wouldn't have been a question on #1. But but but, the LT from Alabama COULD be good
Welcome back, Gunz...
I'm not willing to assume misses in the draft and while I discount need,I do not ignore it completely.
As for pass-rushers...there's a pretty good list of elite to near-elite ones who have been selected after the 1st round.
That said, I was shocked when Mack was there when we had the 4th pick (IIRC it was the Bortles surprise that left him on the Board). I'd been a Watkins guy up 'til that moment. I converted very quickly only to be crushed when we traded down to take a CB that honestly was not even on my radar.
john dorsey doesnt mess around if he really is looking to improve the team any way possible he should call and see.
I dont know if it would work out salary cap wise in the next couple years with mack and garrett are going to be $100+ million contract players.
Agree... you have to call... but the price is going to be ridiculously high early. Keeping a player's rights is the only leverage a team has so the price is not exactly enticing.
i was a mack honk before any of u were.
Ahem... two years of U of Buffalo here...
I'm not a big fan of the player that thinks he's gotta get so much money that he cripples his own team.....or a new team. I just don't see it as being a 'team player'.
Child, please... Did you ever turn down a raise for the good of the company? To keep in line with your peers? Didn't think so.
This is his shot to cash.
Welcome back, Gunz...
I'm not willing to assume misses in the draft and while I discount need,I do not ignore it completely.
As for pass-rushers...there's a pretty good list of elite to near-elite ones who have been selected after the 1st round.
That said, I was shocked when Mack was there when we had the 4th pick (IIRC it was the Bortles surprise that left him on the Board). I'd been a Watkins guy up 'til that moment. I converted very quickly only to be crushed when we traded down to take a CB that honestly was not even on my radar.
Agree... you have to call... but the price is going to be ridiculously high early. Keeping a player's rights is the only leverage a team has so the price is not exactly enticing.
Ahem... two years of U of Buffalo here...
Child, please... Did you ever turn down a raise for the good of the company? To keep in line with your peers? Didn't think so.
This is his shot to cash.
It's not assuming a miss though. Chubb could be a pro bowl player for Denver, but there is a difference in PB and DPOY.
It is just a pet peeve, and this isnt the first time I have said something about people and coveting picks more than proven player. The example of Gilbert is that maybe he goes 16th, but he was still going to be a 1st round pick. So everyone missed on a grade.
But an example of what I am talking about from past. "No way do you trade a 2nd or 3rd for Landry". Yes the Browns got him for less, but that wasnt the argument being made. That argument was that pick was more valuable. Once the Browns got him, "we just got the best slot receiver in the NFL". And usually it's the same guys who say "that was a terrible pick we took at x"
Just be consistent, not one set of rules at one point, another next week, and yet another the week after.
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What is this "con-sis-ten-cy" of which you speak???
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
If he goes to far the market will react accordingly. If a GM pays a player so much that it cripples their roster that is on the GM, not the player, IMO.
I heard this on the radio this morning: that Jon Gruden is actually the guy with the say so on Mack's contract, not the GM McKenzie, or even the owner Mark Davis. And Jon has been talking to his brother Jay....who as you know is the HC of the Redskins. Recall that it is the Redskins that twice put the franchise tag on Kirk Cousins. It was speculated that the Raiders may do the same with Mack: Make him play out his contract he has, then do a double franchise tag on him for two years beyond that.
I heard this on the radio this morning: that Jon Gruden is actually the guy with the say so on Mack's contract, not the GM McKenzie, or even the owner Mark Davis. And Jon has been talking to his brother Jay....who as you know is the HC of the Redskins. Recall that it is the Redskins that twice put the franchise tag on Kirk Cousins. It was speculated that the Raiders may do the same with Mack: Make him play out his contract he has, then do a double franchise tag on him for two years beyond that.
Some people weren't paying attention- no offense to you Gip. The red is exactly what I've been saying. Will Mack sit out and pout to the tune of $13 million this year? The Raiders don't currently have the cap room to give him a huge signing bonus.
All this Mack to the Browns is wishful speculation by some Browns fans here. The odds of him actually landing in Cleveland are incredibly remote.
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Hey fellas, long time no post.
This is one of those things I have said in the past that just is a pet peeve to me.
"I wouldn't trade x pick for him, look at what we COULD get." True. Could get a great player, or could get Gilbert. Maybe not at 8, but it's not like Gilbert was going to be a low pick, he still would have been a 1st rounder. I did see him as a bust because of his skills, but that is beside the point.
Mack IS PROVEN. As in Defensive Player of the year proven.
I am not talking about the guys who are saying something about his salary, even though you get what you pay for, again DEFENSIVE PLAYER OF THE YEAR.
I'm talking about people who cover picks more than proven. If Mack were in the past draft with his tape from NFL, it wouldn't have been a question on #1. But but but, the LT from Alabama COULD be good
This is one of those things I have said in the past that just is a pet peeve to me.
"I wouldn't trade x pick for him, look at what we COULD get."
And there is that. Right? What would you be doing with the draft pick? Draft someone that you HOPE might be somewhere near as good as Mack? If you can work out a deal, might as well get the real thing. - He's obviously a talent that would make any defense more than a little bit better. But he's one of those guys that has to be paid like he's the best player in the league, by far. I'm reminded of a Ravens team photo after Flaco signed his mega deal. The team was sitting on a set of bleachers.....and every player except Flaco was edited out of the picture.
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This is one of those things I have said in the past that just is a pet peeve to me.
"I wouldn't trade x pick for him, look at what we COULD get."
And there is that. Right? What would you be doing with the draft pick? Draft someone that you HOPE might be somewhere near as good as Mack? If you can work out a deal, might as well get the real thing. - He's obviously a talent that would make any defense more than a little bit better. But he's one of those guys that has to be paid like he's the best player in the league, by far. I'm reminded of a Ravens team photo after Flaco signed his mega deal. The team was sitting on a set of bleachers.....and every player except Flaco was edited out of the picture.
And there is that. Right? What would you be doing with the draft pick? Draft someone that you HOPE might be somewhere near as good as Mack? If you can work out a deal, might as well get the real thing. - He's obviously a talent that would make any defense more than a little bit better. But he's one of those guys that has to be paid like he's the best player in the league, by far. I'm reminded of a Ravens team photo after Flaco signed his mega deal. The team was sitting on a set of bleachers.....and every player except Flaco was edited out of the picture.
I'm not saying you should do it no matter what. Of course the contract plays into it. That isnt my beef. Mine is with exactly what I wrote, cant do this because X could be there and could be good.
I dont believe any team has ever drafted someone especially high and said, yea we took him because he isnt going to be good. Raiders thought Russell was their future, Browns with Gilbert, and Patriots didn't draft Brady to be best QB of all time.
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u cant sign a guy who breaks ur cap situation when u have young players like we do that will have to be paid. Him alone isnt taking us to the playoffs. Ill revisit this idea after this season when we know where we're at. If we get a real good look at the playoffs, unlikely, but if we do we can consider signing him cause we wont have that high a draft pick anyway.
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And there is that. Right? What would you be doing with the draft pick? Draft someone that you HOPE might be somewhere near as good as Mack? If you can work out a deal, might as well get the real thing. - He's obviously a talent that would make any defense more than a little bit better. But he's one of those guys that has to be paid like he's the best player in the league, by far. I'm reminded of a Ravens team photo after Flaco signed his mega deal. The team was sitting on a set of bleachers.....and every player except Flaco was edited out of the picture.
I'm not saying you should do it no matter what. Of course the contract plays into it. That isnt my beef. Mine is with exactly what I wrote, cant do this because X could be there and could be good.
I dont believe any team has ever drafted someone especially high and said, yea we took him because he isnt going to be good. Raiders thought Russell was their future, Browns with Gilbert, and Patriots didn't draft Brady to be best QB of all time.
I'm not saying you should do it no matter what.
....but there's nothing wrong with the general idea of acquiring proven talent. What's a draft pick? It's a hope and a prayer. What's proven talent? It's not a hope and a prayer.
We trade a draft pick to team X......for a proven player. We tell team X, Please use that draft pick to draft a good prospect. If he turns out to be good, perhaps we'll trade you another draft pick for HIM.
BEING A BROWNS FAN IS A TEST TO SEE HOW MUCH YOU CAN TAKE -
I'm not saying you should do it no matter what.
....but there's nothing wrong with the general idea of acquiring proven talent. What's a draft pick? It's a hope and a prayer. What's proven talent? It's not a hope and a prayer.
We trade a draft pick to team X......for a proven player. We tell team X, Please use that draft pick to draft a good prospect. If he turns out to be good, perhaps we'll trade you another draft pick for HIM.
....but there's nothing wrong with the general idea of acquiring proven talent. What's a draft pick? It's a hope and a prayer. What's proven talent? It's not a hope and a prayer.
We trade a draft pick to team X......for a proven player. We tell team X, Please use that draft pick to draft a good prospect. If he turns out to be good, perhaps we'll trade you another draft pick for HIM.
That is exactly what I have been saying
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....but there's nothing wrong with the general idea of acquiring proven talent. What's a draft pick? It's a hope and a prayer. What's proven talent? It's not a hope and a prayer.
We trade a draft pick to team X......for a proven player. We tell team X, Please use that draft pick to draft a good prospect. If he turns out to be good, perhaps we'll trade you another draft pick for HIM.
That is exactly what I have been saying
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I'm not saying you should do it no matter what.
....but there's nothing wrong with the general idea of acquiring proven talent. What's a draft pick? It's a hope and a prayer. What's proven talent? It's not a hope and a prayer.
We trade a draft pick to team X......for a proven player. We tell team X, Please use that draft pick to draft a good prospect. If he turns out to be good, perhaps we'll trade you another draft pick for HIM.
....but there's nothing wrong with the general idea of acquiring proven talent.
there's nothing wrong with that unless the talent wants cap imploding money and said talent doesn't get this "current" team deep into the playoffs. For 21m that's a "piece" that gets us "home". As I said, for 15 or 16m....I would consider it. But not now, I would need a better idea of where this team is. If the defense isn't "close"...we're paying 21m and wrecking our ability to sign current talent, for a guy that's just gonna give the fans a few highlight sacks but get us nowhere in the rankings. That's not worth it, as much as I love Khalil mack...it isn't worth it.
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I'm not saying you should do it no matter what.
....but there's nothing wrong with the general idea of acquiring proven talent. What's a draft pick? It's a hope and a prayer. What's proven talent? It's not a hope and a prayer.
We trade a draft pick to team X......for a proven player. We tell team X, Please use that draft pick to draft a good prospect. If he turns out to be good, perhaps we'll trade you another draft pick for HIM.
....but there's nothing wrong with the general idea of acquiring proven talent. What's a draft pick? It's a hope and a prayer. What's proven talent? It's not a hope and a prayer.
We trade a draft pick to team X......for a proven player. We tell team X, Please use that draft pick to draft a good prospect. If he turns out to be good, perhaps we'll trade you another draft pick for HIM.
That's you're fallacy- You don't pay Kahlil Mack $21 million unless you think he's taking you to the Super Bowl. Just look back at NFL history. Name me one defensive player (other than Reggie White) FA who fits that description. Suh couldn't do it in Miami- so Mack is a sure shot in Cleveland? Not iMHO.
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....but there's nothing wrong with the general idea of acquiring proven talent. What's a draft pick? It's a hope and a prayer. What's proven talent? It's not a hope and a prayer.
We trade a draft pick to team X......for a proven player. We tell team X, Please use that draft pick to draft a good prospect. If he turns out to be good, perhaps we'll trade you another draft pick for HIM.
That's you're fallacy- You don't pay Kahlil Mack $21 million unless you think he's taking you to the Super Bowl. Just look back at NFL history. Name me one defensive player (other than Reggie White) FA who fits that description. Suh couldn't do it in Miami- so Mack is a sure shot in Cleveland? Not iMHO.
That's you're fallacy- You don't pay Kahlil Mack $21 million unless
I happen to agree with that. A team certainly cannot have every position paid at the top of the market value. I'm just sayin' that a draft pick is a token that you put in a slot machine in April. (at least that's how it's been for us). Whereas trading a draft pick for Landry takes the slot machine out of the equation. Although his bill will come due next year.
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Heard on Fox Sports the rumors are the Raiders want two first round picks for Mack- which means they're really not interested in trading him. We'll see how serious he is when he starts missing game checks.
Was also posited him and Aaron Donald are waiting it out to see who gets paid first to set the market. But IMHO that was already done when Suh broke the bank in Miami. I'd like to believe teams wised up after that fiasco.
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Heard on Fox Sports the rumors are the Raiders want two first round picks for Mack- which means they're really not interested in trading him. We'll see how serious he is when he starts missing game checks.
Was also posited him and Aaron Donald are waiting it out to see who gets paid first to set the market. But IMHO that was already done when Suh broke the bank in Miami. I'd like to believe teams wised up after that fiasco.
Heard on Fox Sports the rumors are the Raiders want two first round picks for Mack- which means they're really not interested in trading him. We'll see how serious he is when he starts missing game checks.
Was also posited him and Aaron Donald are waiting it out to see who gets paid first to set the market. But IMHO that was already done when Suh broke the bank in Miami. I'd like to believe teams wised up after that fiasco.
Well I doubt anyone wised up. Just liked Flacco set the market, and now guys are getting close to double. Contracts have just gone up, so has the cap.
Suh isnt a great example either. Because he could be even more valuable if he focused just on doing his best playing on the field. His antics have cost him money. And Donald is quite a bit better than him
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Heard on Fox Sports the rumors are the Raiders want two first round picks for Mack- which means they're really not interested in trading him. We'll see how serious he is when he starts missing game checks.
Was also posited him and Aaron Donald are waiting it out to see who gets paid first to set the market. But IMHO that was already done when Suh broke the bank in Miami. I'd like to believe teams wised up after that fiasco.
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...for one of the eleven guys who tackle people.
right. u go after a guy like that either in the draft or in FA where u know he's coming cause he wants to play here and not being strongarmed by a team thats saying if u want out its gonna have to be to these huckleberries who are fixin to.give us 2 1st rounders. no uh uh no way
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