Bold idea that would change the landscape of sports in Cleveland
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Zombo said:
I don't know how you fit an NFL stadium and all of the extra parking in the footprint of Progressive. I don't think this was thought through.
Zombo
Parking is all over the place... That wouldn't be as big a deal as your other point - trying to fit a 65,000+ seat retractable domed football stadium into the footprint of what was a 43,000 seat baseball park. That could be interesting.
I'm trying to find how big the footprint of Progressive Field is in comparison to Seattle's CenturyLink Stadium - a football field that was creatively "crammed" into a relatively small area, but haven't yet.
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Zombo said:
I don't know how you fit an NFL stadium and all of the extra parking in the footprint of Progressive. I don't think this was thought through.
Zombo
Parking is all over the place... That wouldn't be as big a deal as your other point - trying to fit a 65,000+ seat retractable domed football stadium into the footprint of what was a 43,000 seat baseball park. That could be interesting.
I'm trying to find how big the footprint of Progressive Field is in comparison to Seattle's CenturyLink Stadium - a football field that was creatively "crammed" into a relatively small area, but haven't yet.
Parking is all over the place... That wouldn't be as big a deal as your other point - trying to fit a 65,000+ seat retractable domed football stadium into the footprint of what was a 43,000 seat baseball park. That could be interesting.
I'm sure if Modell had gone along- that site would have been configured completely differently. Of course by now, at 35+ years old- that stadium would be considered obsolete.
Did look it up- the oldest NFL stadium that hasn't been totally reconfigured (that's Soldier Field) is Arrowhead (1972) and will probably be in use for at least another 20 years. It was built to last. BTW- since you're looking for a new stadium- Kansas City also did it right. It's outside of town, the Royals stadium is next door, with probably a square mile of parking surrounding it. The Tailgating there is legendary.
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Didn't realize the National Park acquired the Richfield site Gipper. Regarding the new Rams digs SoFi Stadium- it's in Inglewood, southwest of LA.
Taking a quick look at satellite imagery of the Cleveland area- it's slim pickings to find open land. Highland Golf Course, and nothing until you get way out on the SW side near La Grange or Medina. Plenty of Parks- which are off limits to development.
Right...unless they start tearing down a whole neighborhood (blighted?)...or commercial district.
Right...unless they start tearing down a whole neighborhood (blighted?)...or commercial district.
I mean, in a city that at one time had over 900,000 people, and now has under 400,000, you have to think there's some room SOMEWHERE... ?
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Parking is all over the place... That wouldn't be as big a deal as your other point - trying to fit a 65,000+ seat retractable domed football stadium into the footprint of what was a 43,000 seat baseball park. That could be interesting.
I'm sure if Modell had gone along- that site would have been configured completely differently. Of course by now, at 35+ years old- that stadium would be considered obsolete.
Did look it up- the oldest NFL stadium that hasn't been totally reconfigured (that's Soldier Field) is Arrowhead (1972) and will probably be in use for at least another 20 years. It was built to last. BTW- since you're looking for a new stadium- Kansas City also did it right. It's outside of town, the Royals stadium is next door, with probably a square mile of parking surrounding it. The Tailgating there is legendary.
Did look it up- the oldest NFL stadium that hasn't been totally reconfigured (that's Soldier Field) is Arrowhead (1972) and will probably be in use for at least another 20 years. It was built to last. BTW- since you're looking for a new stadium- Kansas City also did it right. It's outside of town, the Royals stadium is next door, with probably a square mile of parking surrounding it. The Tailgating there is legendary.
Your feeling on watching a football game indoors is akin to my thoughts on building stadiums in the sticks and surrounding them with parking lots.
Zero ambiance.
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I did a fairly close aerial inspection (google maps) of Cleveland, and honestly I do not see any footprint big enough to support a stadium and the parking you say is needed. There may be some old industrial sites in the Flats, but traffic in and out of there would be a nightmare. There may be some space south of I480.....but then you are getting into the suburbs. Or unless you take up valuable park land, which the parks would not give up....and besides, the terrain in those park areas would not be suitable...hill/streams/rivers. You could maybe find land in Brunswick or Medina County.
Or...hey, something like this: take over a golf course and build it there. Like, say, Sleepy Hollow, or ones near Fairview Park. Golf courses are going out of business like crazy around here. The oldest golf course in Summit County is going out.
What did Rodney Dangerfield say about golf courses and cemeteries, the two biggest wastes of real estate there is. (Caddyshack)
Golf courses make great housing developments all landscaped out -or- maybe a good starting point for a mega stadium complex with parking !
What did Rodney Dangerfield say about golf courses and cemeteries, the two biggest wastes of real estate there is. (Caddyshack)
Golf courses make great housing developments all landscaped out -or- maybe a good starting point for a mega stadium complex with parking !
Cemetaries have people dying to get in.
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What did Rodney Dangerfield say about golf courses and cemeteries, the two biggest wastes of real estate there is. (Caddyshack)
Golf courses make great housing developments all landscaped out -or- maybe a good starting point for a mega stadium complex with parking !
Well, that is just what is happening to a couple of them around here. Brookside Country Club in Norton, perhaps the oldest golf course in Summit Co. has been sold to real estate developers.
Valley View...gone. Brandywine CC....gone. Both Summit Co. Pine Valley near me here in Medina Co. almost suffered the same fate, but apparently the land developer has decided that it will be saved.
I a guessing that Millenials just don't like to play golf as much as older generations.
Well, that is just what is happening to a couple of them around here. Brookside Country Club in Norton, perhaps the oldest golf course in Summit Co. has been sold to real estate developers.
Valley View...gone. Brandywine CC....gone. Both Summit Co. Pine Valley near me here in Medina Co. almost suffered the same fate, but apparently the land developer has decided that it will be saved.
I a guessing that Millenials just don't like to play golf as much as older generations.
They took the old Candywood golf course not far from the YGN airport which was really nice and due to dropping customers closed it, fenced it in, put game in it......and charge people money to hunt them with high power rifles. The surrounding farm community hate the idea but can do nothing about it.
During the steel mill days there were thousands of well paid workers, tons of leagues all gone like many of the old courses.
They truly are more profitable to cut up into McMansion housing developments. But if you have decent freeway access they could make a good stadium site.
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What did Rodney Dangerfield say about golf courses and cemeteries, the two biggest wastes of real estate there is. (Caddyshack)
Golf courses make great housing developments all landscaped out -or- maybe a good starting point for a mega stadium complex with parking !
Well, that is just what is happening to a couple of them around here. Brookside Country Club in Norton, perhaps the oldest golf course in Summit Co. has been sold to real estate developers.
Valley View...gone. Brandywine CC....gone. Both Summit Co. Pine Valley near me here in Medina Co. almost suffered the same fate, but apparently the land developer has decided that it will be saved.
I a guessing that Millenials just don't like to play golf as much as older generations.
Well, that is just what is happening to a couple of them around here. Brookside Country Club in Norton, perhaps the oldest golf course in Summit Co. has been sold to real estate developers.
Valley View...gone. Brandywine CC....gone. Both Summit Co. Pine Valley near me here in Medina Co. almost suffered the same fate, but apparently the land developer has decided that it will be saved.
I a guessing that Millenials just don't like to play golf as much as older generations.
They like to play golf ...on a video game system
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Did look it up- the oldest NFL stadium that hasn't been totally reconfigured (that's Soldier Field) is Arrowhead (1972) and will probably be in use for at least another 20 years. It was built to last. BTW- since you're looking for a new stadium- Kansas City also did it right. It's outside of town, the Royals stadium is next door, with probably a square mile of parking surrounding it. The Tailgating there is legendary.
Your feeling on watching a football game indoors is akin to my thoughts on building stadiums in the sticks and surrounding them with parking lots.
Zero ambiance.
Your feeling on watching a football game indoors is akin to my thoughts on building stadiums in the sticks and surrounding them with parking lots.
Zero ambiance.
I just had another thought- and you probably won't like it. Can't say it's anything original- the idea was brought up before. If you want a dome, and can't figure out where to put it. Put it right where First Energy is right now. Tear down FE, and the Browns play at Ohio State until the new place is done. The Vikings did the same gambit playing at The University of Minnesota.
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Football is played in the fall and winter, but yes, I did overlook the advantage of having of a dome for summertime events.
Clearly you've never spent a September in Houston...
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
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Your feeling on watching a football game indoors is akin to my thoughts on building stadiums in the sticks and surrounding them with parking lots.
Zero ambiance.
I just had another thought- and you probably won't like it. Can't say it's anything original- the idea was brought up before. If you want a dome, and can't figure out where to put it. Put it right where First Energy is right now. Tear down FE, and the Browns play at Ohio State until the new place is done. The Vikings did the same gambit playing at The University of Minnesota.
I just had another thought- and you probably won't like it. Can't say it's anything original- the idea was brought up before. If you want a dome, and can't figure out where to put it. Put it right where First Energy is right now. Tear down FE, and the Browns play at Ohio State until the new place is done. The Vikings did the same gambit playing at The University of Minnesota.
Or when the Bears played down south in Champaign at the U of Illinois while Soldier Field was redone.
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Right...unless they start tearing down a whole neighborhood (blighted?)...or commercial district.
I mean, in a city that at one time had over 900,000 people, and now has under 400,000, you have to think there's some room SOMEWHERE... ?
I mean, in a city that at one time had over 900,000 people, and now has under 400,000, you have to think there's some room SOMEWHERE... ?
Go ahead and look at the satellite images that Hoorta and I have, and then tell us where.. We are all ears and eyes.
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Well, that is just what is happening to a couple of them around here. Brookside Country Club in Norton, perhaps the oldest golf course in Summit Co. has been sold to real estate developers.
Valley View...gone. Brandywine CC....gone. Both Summit Co. Pine Valley near me here in Medina Co. almost suffered the same fate, but apparently the land developer has decided that it will be saved.
I a guessing that Millenials just don't like to play golf as much as older generations.
They like to play golf ...on a video game system
They like to play golf ...on a video game system
Is that really it....they just do video games? I kind of gave up golf about 20 years ago....but I could consider getting into it again....just for the camaraderie aspects. About the same for bowling. I put my money now into travel, and I take my walks in parks.
I also think that the whole idea of Tiger getting minorities heavily involved in golf also went up in smoke. Oh, there was some of it....not as much as expected.
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Your feeling on watching a football game indoors is akin to my thoughts on building stadiums in the sticks and surrounding them with parking lots.
Zero ambiance.
I just had another thought- and you probably won't like it. Can't say it's anything original- the idea was brought up before. If you want a dome, and can't figure out where to put it. Put it right where First Energy is right now. Tear down FE, and the Browns play at Ohio State until the new place is done. The Vikings did the same gambit playing at The University of Minnesota.
I just had another thought- and you probably won't like it. Can't say it's anything original- the idea was brought up before. If you want a dome, and can't figure out where to put it. Put it right where First Energy is right now. Tear down FE, and the Browns play at Ohio State until the new place is done. The Vikings did the same gambit playing at The University of Minnesota.
Except the Univ. of Minnesota Stadium was, literally a long walk from the Metrodome. About a mile, mile and a half at most. (my son worked right across the street from the Minn Stadium for a couple of years....and from his place you could look down the street there and see the Metrodome...or the now US Bank Stadium.
Ohio Stadium is 145 miles away from First Energy. So unless you want to alienate a lot of your fans, you shouldn't go that far away....unless, of course, you are trying to court that market, which Haslam probably would want to do as he now owns the soccer team that is there.
Akron Univerity' s Infocision Stadium is actually the 3rd largest college football stadium in Ohio....after only Ohio Stadium, and the old Nippert Stadium where Cincinnati U plays. And it is new...built in 2009, and holds 30,000.....which is more than the Chargers have been playing in the last few years; and it is larger, and closer than the HOF stadium (22K capacity). It could be the better alternative...if you felt that there had to be a tear down.
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I mean, in a city that at one time had over 900,000 people, and now has under 400,000, you have to think there's some room SOMEWHERE... ?
Go ahead and look at the satellite images that Hoorta and I have, and then tell us where.. We are all ears and eyes.
Go ahead and look at the satellite images that Hoorta and I have, and then tell us where.. We are all ears and eyes.
They somehow figured out places to build the Jacobs Field, Gund Arena and the Wolstein Center in the late 80s/early 90s, I'm sure they could figure out somewhere to do it again.
But I guess nothing new can be built within the city limits of Cleveland. It's all full. CLEVELAND IS CLOSED FOR FURTHER PROGRESS! ? Someone better tell Dee!
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Go ahead and look at the satellite images that Hoorta and I have, and then tell us where.. We are all ears and eyes.
They somehow figured out places to build the Jacobs Field, Gund Arena and the Wolstein Center in the late 80s/early 90s, I'm sure they could figure out somewhere to do it again.
But I guess nothing new can be built within the city limits of Cleveland. It's all full. CLEVELAND IS CLOSED FOR FURTHER PROGRESS! ? Someone better tell Dee!
They somehow figured out places to build the Jacobs Field, Gund Arena and the Wolstein Center in the late 80s/early 90s, I'm sure they could figure out somewhere to do it again.
But I guess nothing new can be built downtown. It's all full. CLEVELAND IS CLOSED FOR FURTHER PROGRESS! ?
No one is saying that.....We are saying for YOU to tell where YOU would propose to put it where it would fit. And FYI, what did they do to build the Jake/Gundarena/Wolstein? They had to tear down a lot of buildings that were there. Here is an aerial view of where these things are now. This is an older picture, maybe even in the 50s. But I recall the Central Market, which was the main facility there, plus there were a number of older warehouses and the like:
Compare now:
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Those are some seriously cool photos...
The first one is from the 1930s... if you look at Cleveland Stadium - it doesn't have lights yet. They added lights in 1939 I believe.
I'm kind of intrigued about the Wolstein Center area... the next time I'm in downtown I think I'll venture over and check it out. Seems like an area that if the Browns could buy the arena off of CSU (if CSU is serious about wanting to rid itself of it) that there might be some other older barely used buildings that could be flattened for a new Browns stadium.
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