Take Tim Couch out and put in Derek Anderson
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and one can't forget that DA has had some shit games a lot worse than Quinn has dished up so far.
So what do you want, a consistantly mediocre QB that loses 80 percent of his starts, or an occasionally brilliant but occasionally bad QB that's won half his starts with a team with little history of winning?
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I think our issue has little to do with the QB and a lot to do with the offense as a whole and the horrible playcalling.
.... aka Daboll.
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would have had an offense today.
As opposed to that awesome DA led offense last season right - where he couldn't pass for an avg of 135.5 yards the first 4 games?
He sucked ass last season, so now it is your turn to eat the shit QB play we had to do since the 2nd half of 2007. Deal with it.
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As opposed to that awesome DA led offense last season right - where he couldn't pass for an avg of 135.5 yards the first 4 games?
He sucked ass last season, so now it is your turn to eat the shit QB play we had to do since the 2nd half of 2007. Deal with it.
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The horrible Qb in the second half of the season produced a 5 3 record.
0 @PIT L 31-28 16 35 123 45.7 3.51 16 3 0 0.0 83.4 2 5 2.5 6 0
11 @BALW 33-30 24 38 274 63.2 7.21 50 0 1 1.0 73.8 4 -4 -1.0 2 1
12 HOU W 27-17 24 35 253 68.6 7.23 25 2 1 1.0 96.5 0 0 0.0 0 0
13 @ARI L 27-21 21 41 304 51.2 7.42 67 2 2 1.0 71.6 2 10 5.0 10 0
14 @NYJ W 24-18 16 29 185 55.2 6.38 45 2 1 0.0 83.3 3 3 1.0 5 0
15 BUF W 8-0 9 24 137 37.5 5.71 25 0 0 1.0 57.1 1 0 0.0 0 0
16 @CINL 19-14 29 48 251 60.4 5.23 22 2 4 1.0 53.4 1 6 6.0 6 0
17 SF W 20-7 11 20 152 55.0 7.60 45 1 1 1.0 75.4 1 0 0.0 0
Ratings of 83.4, 73.8, 96.5, 71.6, 83.3, 57.1, 53.4 and 75.4. Not spectacular by any means but really not as bad as you probably remember. There were more games than the Cincy game in the second half of the year.
and even if you ONLY count the second half of 2007 and the SHITY 2008 season DA is still 8 wins and 9 losses. I mean the horrific game in Cincinnati was a 53.4 rating and BQs rating last game was 58.7.
Bq's QB rating going in to this game was 68 for his career and I don't think that this game will have helped. In 5 career starts BQ has 3 TDs, 4 interceptions and 2 fumbles. That is a TD for every TWO turnovers. And I have seen DA called a turnover machine with a turnover rate of 1.29 every game. Well BQ has an average of 1.2 and for this year he averages 2 turnovers a game.
I still say start BQ and leave him in there. But I just don't agree that DA was a bad as many seem to have stuck in their heads. Did DA play great in 2008? Of course not, but he did start the season with a concussion and no receivers against 3 of the better defenses in the league and in game 4 he beat the Bengals who did not have a bad defense either.
And as far as sacks go DA was sacked 4 times in ONE game (against Baltimore) last year and NONE in 2007 so why would you think he would ever get sacked 8 times in one game (as some have claimed would happen)?
I do not think that BQ has had any 4 interception games but then again I don't think BQ has had any 5 TD games either (since only 3 in 5 starts). DA had 2 multiple interception games in 2008 and 2 multiple TD games also and even though he had a horrible year he still threw more TDs than Interceptions. In 2007 DA had 4 multiple interception games and 10 multiple TD games. In 2006 he had 2 multiple TD games and 2 multiple Interception games. So in 31 total games DA has had 14 multiple TD games and 8 multiple Interception games. 23 games where he has thrown a TD and 21 games where he has thrown and Interception. So if DA throws a TD (74%) then he is 61% likely to throw 2 or more TDs and in games where DA throws a interception(68% of time) he is only 38% likely to have multiple interceptions.
BQ has throw a TD in 2 of his 5 starts (40%) and is likely to throw multiple TDs in half of those games (which equates to 20%) and he has thrown interceptions in 3 of his 5 starts (60%) and multiple interceptions in one of those games (also 20%).
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No, really, what's it like there?
From your posts, it seems very different from our world. Here in our world, the Browns drafted Brady Quinn because they needed a starting QB. We didn't have one worth mentioning, which is why Quinn was drafted in the first place.
In our world, we failed miserably last year partially because of poor QB play. Our QB last year had a penchant for throwing the ball to the other team and sometimes scoring points for them in the process. Is this how football is played where you come from? It's not how we play it here, so I was wondering.
It's interesting also how in your world, the TD-less streak is Quinn's fault, even though he didn't play in most of those games. Is that part of how things are counted in Bizarro world? Backwards and without meaning?
That would explain why you're so good at this counting you do!
In our world, we failed miserably last year partially because of poor QB play. Our QB last year had a penchant for throwing the ball to the other team and sometimes scoring points for them in the process. Is this how football is played where you come from? It's not how we play it here, so I was wondering.
Last year DA had 10 turnovers in 10 games. BQ has a career 2-1 turnover to TD ratio and is averaging 2 turnovers a game this year... is that an improvement over DA?
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I'm writing this after a good 5-hour sleep after the game, so I'm not in a typical postgame mood.
Let's face it. We have a mediocre-to-bad team on both sides of the ball AND both our QBs suck.
We're doomed again.
The Mark Sanchez trade down might haunt us for years although I do not think QB is the biggest problem we have.
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I just heard that Kanye West stepped-in and took over Daboll job last night.
that bastard.
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and one can't forget that DA has had some shit games a lot worse than Quinn has dished up so far.
So what do you want, a consistantly mediocre QB that loses 80 percent of his starts, or an occasionally brilliant but occasionally bad QB that's won half his starts with a team with little history of winning?
So what do you want, a consistantly mediocre QB that loses 80 percent of his starts, or an occasionally brilliant but occasionally bad QB that's won half his starts with a team with little history of winning?
More like occasionally brilliant, mostly bad. You apparently haven't watched his last 18-20 games, have you?
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There's a lot of Lumberghian-level stupidity going on in here tonight.
It's obvious that what this team needs right now is a big-armed, scatter-shot QB to right the ship. Because he's been so good at bringing order and stability to the team in the past.
Guys, this is Quinn's 2nd start of the year. There are plenty of offensive issues, especially at RT and RB, not to mention WR and TE.
But let's keep a little perspective: it was 10-6 in the 3rd quarter, 13-6 into the 4th quarter. Think about that for a sec, those of you blowing your brains all over the board.
10-6 in the 3rd, 13-6 in the 4th.
Despite Dumervil making St. Clair look like a practice player, despite 2 AWFUL turnovers, despite the inability to run the ball AT ALL:
10-6 in the 3rd, 13-6 in the 4th.
People: WE WERE STILL IN THIS GAME IN THE SECOND HALF.
Quinn didn't make the killer mistake. He didn't sink his team. He didn't throw the dumb pick out of frustration, he didn't throw the back-breaking pick 6, he didn't pick a fight with his WRs and kick a pylon.
Quinn didn't have a ton of positives but he did have a few really good completions and he had ZERO killer mistakes.
For those of you who actually REMEMBER last year and the end of 2007, that is a HUGE upgrade at the QB position.
Again, QB is NOT our biggest issue anymore no matter how people want to spin it.
I didn't get to watch the game, I was a t work. But, if I read Yahoo correctly BQ fumbled the ball which turned into a TD for the Broncos.
3rd-9, CLE13 9:14 B. Quinn rushed up the middle for no gain. B. Quinn fumbled. D. Reid recovered fumble
Denver - 9:14
1st-10, CLE10 9:14 K. Moreno rushed up the middle for 4 yard gain
2nd-5, CLE5 8:37 K. Moreno rushed to the right for 3 yard gain
3rd-2, CLE2 8:03 K. Orton passed to T. Scheffler to the left for 2 yard touchdown. M. Prater made PAT
Now since I did not get to watch the game you can answer for me if that fumble was BQ's fault or the winds? Maybe a fumble that turns into a TD is not a killer mistake. I don't know. But please do tell me who's fault the fumble was.
And 10 - 6 in the third quarter and 13 - 6 early in the fourth quarter. Sounds to me like the defense was playing pretty good hoping that the offense could produce.
First possession they start near the 25 yard line of Denver and get a FG and then on the third possession they DO move the ball 51 yards for another FG.
Only 1 possession of more than 8 plays *1 out of 12). 5 Possessions of 3 and out and no drives for over 51 yards.
This does sound much more like a offensive problem than a defensive one.
I don't think that putting in DA at this time is a good idea. I stick by what I said earlier, Leave him in until week 10 at least. You need to be sure before you give up on him. But I will say that for BQ's sake I really hope he gets rid of the ball faster next week.
I didn't get to watch the game, I was a t work. But, if I read Yahoo correctly BQ fumbled the ball which turned into a TD for the Broncos.
3rd-9, CLE13 9:14 B. Quinn rushed up the middle for no gain. B. Quinn fumbled. D. Reid recovered fumble
Denver - 9:14
1st-10, CLE10 9:14 K. Moreno rushed up the middle for 4 yard gain
2nd-5, CLE5 8:37 K. Moreno rushed to the right for 3 yard gain
3rd-2, CLE2 8:03 K. Orton passed to T. Scheffler to the left for 2 yard touchdown. M. Prater made PAT
Now since I did not get to watch the game you can answer for me if that fumble was BQ's fault or the winds? Maybe a fumble that turns into a TD is not a killer mistake. I don't know. But please do tell me who's fault the fumble was.
And 10 - 6 in the third quarter and 13 - 6 early in the fourth quarter. Sounds to me like the defense was playing pretty good hoping that the offense could produce.
First possession they start near the 25 yard line of Denver and get a FG and then on the third possession they DO move the ball 51 yards for another FG.
Only 1 possession of more than 8 plays *1 out of 12). 5 Possessions of 3 and out and no drives for over 51 yards.
This does sound much more like a offensive problem than a defensive one.
I don't think that putting in DA at this time is a good idea. I stick by what I said earlier, Leave him in until week 10 at least. You need to be sure before you give up on him. But I will say that for BQ's sake I really hope he gets rid of the ball faster next week.
It wasn't BQ's fumble, it was a very bad snap by Mack with Quinn in the shotgun, basically rolled the snap on the ground.
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Z- we saw what pressure on the QB did to the other Brady yesterday. Nobody questions his release or arm.
Conversely, with writers desperate for a sexy storyline rather than discussing what actually happened during the game, Sanchez is a God ready for the probowl. Outside of the TD pass, his stats weren't too different than Queens.
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I just couldn't believe how inaccurate some of BQ's passes were, even in garbage time. He was so off. Hitting the back of the defender one time! He might need to to quit being a gym rat. Those inflated biceps could be screwing up a lot..seriously. BQ also looks like he's playin' scared out there. Doesn't look at all like he's looked in the past. Something's up.
We all know DA stinks as a captain. No leadership. I'm so friggin' depressed, like most here I'm sure.
The D seems to look really good on 1st and 2nd down, then they keep getting burned on third downs though. As said, earlier, tired from all the 3n outs of the offense.
Get Cribbs outta there, and play the rookies, or just play him as a third receiver/WildDawg thing. He's getting spread thin and we'll just either get hurt, or he's too tired to do anything well.
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There's a lot of Lumberghian-level stupidity going on in here tonight.
It's obvious that what this team needs right now is a big-armed, scatter-shot QB to right the ship. Because he's been so good at bringing order and stability to the team in the past.
Guys, this is Quinn's 2nd start of the year. There are plenty of offensive issues, especially at RT and RB, not to mention WR and TE.
But let's keep a little perspective: it was 10-6 in the 3rd quarter, 13-6 into the 4th quarter. Think about that for a sec, those of you blowing your brains all over the board.
10-6 in the 3rd, 13-6 in the 4th.
Despite Dumervil making St. Clair look like a practice player, despite 2 AWFUL turnovers, despite the inability to run the ball AT ALL:
10-6 in the 3rd, 13-6 in the 4th.
People: WE WERE STILL IN THIS GAME IN THE SECOND HALF.
Quinn didn't make the killer mistake. He didn't sink his team. He didn't throw the dumb pick out of frustration, he didn't throw the back-breaking pick 6, he didn't pick a fight with his WRs and kick a pylon.
Quinn didn't have a ton of positives but he did have a few really good completions and he had ZERO killer mistakes.
For those of you who actually REMEMBER last year and the end of 2007, that is a HUGE upgrade at the QB position.
Again, QB is NOT our biggest issue anymore no matter how people want to spin it.
I didn't get to watch the game, I was a t work. But, if I read Yahoo correctly BQ fumbled the ball which turned into a TD for the Broncos.
3rd-9, CLE13 9:14 B. Quinn rushed up the middle for no gain. B. Quinn fumbled. D. Reid recovered fumble
Denver - 9:14
1st-10, CLE10 9:14 K. Moreno rushed up the middle for 4 yard gain
2nd-5, CLE5 8:37 K. Moreno rushed to the right for 3 yard gain
3rd-2, CLE2 8:03 K. Orton passed to T. Scheffler to the left for 2 yard touchdown. M. Prater made PAT
Now since I did not get to watch the game you can answer for me if that fumble was BQ's fault or the winds? Maybe a fumble that turns into a TD is not a killer mistake. I don't know. But please do tell me who's fault the fumble was.
And 10 - 6 in the third quarter and 13 - 6 early in the fourth quarter. Sounds to me like the defense was playing pretty good hoping that the offense could produce.
First possession they start near the 25 yard line of Denver and get a FG and then on the third possession they DO move the ball 51 yards for another FG.
Only 1 possession of more than 8 plays *1 out of 12). 5 Possessions of 3 and out and no drives for over 51 yards.
This does sound much more like a offensive problem than a defensive one.
I don't think that putting in DA at this time is a good idea. I stick by what I said earlier, Leave him in until week 10 at least. You need to be sure before you give up on him. But I will say that for BQ's sake I really hope he gets rid of the ball faster next week.
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So what do you want, a consistantly mediocre QB that loses 80 percent of his starts, or an occasionally brilliant but occasionally bad QB that's won half his starts with a team with little history of winning?
More like occasionally brilliant, mostly bad. You apparently haven't watched his last 18-20 games, have you?
More like occasionally brilliant, mostly bad. You apparently haven't watched his last 18-20 games, have you?
yes, he atleast scored touchdowns.
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@jadbf said:
For all those that want to say BQ hasn't been the problem in the last two games. All I'll say is, He sure didn't look like the answer to me either.I for one am holding him to the same standard that I have DA. And so far he can't even see that standard from the hole he has dug for himself.
And before all you DA backers start giving me thanks.
I STILL THINK HE SUCKS AND IS NOT THE ANSWER EITHER. I don't believe he would do any better. Would Denver have played a difference defense? Sure, But guess what, they would have played the one that shuts DA down. DA in my opinion has not been able to overcome the part of his game that lets defenses scheme to stop him.
I don't agree with Zombo that Quinn only gets 3 games. I still give him to the bye week because I don't believe putting Anderson in now does anything for us for the future. But Quinn better make HUGE turnaround by the by week, or I'll be calling for them to put Dawson in at QB. He's about the only guy on this team I still respect.
Defending against DA means putting more coverage on the secondary. which means u cant load the box and that gives some hope for the RB to find a few holes. It is not like BQ totally sucks or something. BQ for some reason is not trusted with the long throws else we will be seeing a bit more of those. and when the tight defense allows little holes in the LOS , it is hard for any RB not named AP to gain good yardage.
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Two words... Colt McCoy
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Zombo said:
Yep, and like I said last week: he gets one more chance.
Three strikes and you're out.
Quinn goes o-fer-September and Anderson will take over in October.
Quinn has played very poorly both weeks. I am not impressed at all.
Can't help but wonder about that dude on the bench with big arm and quick release ... would have come in handy yesterday. Dinking and dunking seems good for 6 points of offense each week before the game slips away.
Brady Quinn has started five games, he has looked horrible in three of them, one ugly win, one decent performance in a loss to a horrible defense.
This isn't looking good. I think Mangini gives him one more game.
Zombo
As much as i'd like to agree with you, i won't
We've already screwed the pooch in terms of trade value on all of our qb's.
I don't think our back ups will make a difference.
Quinn is not looking any worse than gm1.
Mangini is working overtime to overcome years of failure.
And as your last statement says
--It's only Baltimore.
Quinn might get killed by B-more and you'll get DA
by default.
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@jadbf said:
And yet still in all those 10-6 DA losses through out his career, I don't remember saying "WOW at least we had a running game".and really defending DA doesn't mean putting more coverage in the secondary, It just means making sure the secondary takes away certain routes while allowing DA to attempt to complete the ones he struggles with.
hey we did have touchdowns. At this point let us worry about getting the touchdows and the pieces we need for it. then we worry about winning.
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Its good to see my freinds to the north have been spewing old Tim Couch's name around... love it.
Look ... the golden boy sux. Take away all this crapola about play-calling, check-downs, and right-tackles(who also suck)--- Any QB - at any level - should know that you have to stretch the defense...you atleast have to threaten with something.... more good things happen on a deep-out than bad things...the NFL has it set up this way. I dont think pretty boy can throw it 40 yards. Honestly.
Add this clown to the list of busts... Timmy Couch spawned the "dink and dunk"...Brady Quinn has mastered it.
Week # 2 and we are way near 1999 than 2009.
Bermeck (who's the next coach, next gm, next RD1 bust...puke, puke, puke)
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