Jonathan Paul Manziel
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If you've gone thru however many "savior" QBs that didnt work out...why diss the next one?
Because history seems to indicate the problem just might be the organization.
You've been married 9 times? Hell, maybe it's YOU.
But...we got a new coach, new GM...why not try a little optimism?
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the unveiling of a new jersey next season
ugh. really?
hey all you johnny fans ya gotta pony up again next year. lol!
he'll look great in silver/grey/brown and orange.....HA!
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Espn scroll:
Browns OT Joe Thomas says Manziel being a good rookie so far in keeping his mouth shut. Rookies should be seen and not heard.
Rofl Joe Thomas, Great soundbyte.
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Lovingly Gay said:
Do yourself a favor and read the SI article about the draft. The experts were very iffy on Johnny and there is a reason he was still available at 22, just like Quinn and Weeden were. And when Cleveland drafted them, they thought they got a steal then too!
The experts thought jamarcus Russell and Ryan leaf were going to be awesome
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@everlastingxxx said:
Thats right Tate was added this offseason. I know about Hawkins, he came in second on Michael Irvins reality show a few years ago. I thought he should have won but Irvin chose the bigger WR.
And then the proper vet WRs, Austin, Bennett & Burleson. Not exactly studs (that's why they were FAs still available in April/May), but Outside of Gordon, our WRs were awful last year. These guys are most likely an upgrade over Little, Benjamin & Bess.
And then the proper vet WRs, Austin, Bennett & Burleson. Not exactly studs (that's why they were FAs still available in April/May), but Outside of Gordon, our WRs were awful last year. These guys are most likely an upgrade over Little, Benjamin & Bess.
Tom Brady proved if the qb is good enough it doesn't matter who the wrs are.
@walterwhite said:
Dude, you're smarter than this.
ESPN is the McDonalds of Sports Analysis and Coverage and plays down to the lowest common denominator of sports fans. RG3 was insanely marketable and had some of the best TV ratings in 2012 and it carried over in 2013. That's the job of the national media to feed their titan markets (Lebron, A-Rod, Yankees, Lakers, Manning, etc)
The National Spotlight will NEVER give Gilbert equal press because Johnny Manziel is one of the most hyped, covered, and popular players EVER. He pulls ratings and revenue by the millions so what the hell exactly do you want ESPN to talk about.? Didn't MATTER where Manziel was going, the circus was following him to town wherever he went.
...and by the way Hoorta, for a guy that isn't real high on Manziel and all the hype, you sure are counter-productive because you do talk about him more than ANYONE and bring more heat to his stories in the threads. Just ignore it if you don't like the hype.Walter- I hope you realize Manziel also has a significant minority out there that can't stand him. & please don't put me in that category post draft.
There isn't any controversy/fame with Gilbert.
The media thrives on controversy, and what's hot to get ratings.
Weird how that one 7th round player gets so much attention, whereas so many other terrific players don't. Why, I thought it was all about football....
Actually, I knew better with the media.
Terrific is boring. Flamboyant, and/or controversial in some way, tends to boost ratings.
I'm sick of it, too.
Seems like the lowest common denominator fo TV viewers keeps getting lower every year Mike.
its baffling to me that hoyer automatically gets the job. He played decent in those 3 games, not amazing. 3 games should never solidify a starting spot. They should let the quarterbacks compete. Hoyers resume is nothing special so far in his career, if he beats out manziel by looking better than him im ok with that. But to tell johnny to act like a backup is bad. All backups should be preparing like they are starters.
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That makes sense. I try to counsel Browns fans not to smack talk about the Pittsburgh Steelers until we have swept them one season. Still, that being said, fuck the Pittsburgh Steelers and the pigs they rode in on.Lovingly Gay said:
The point is that there is a reason Johnny was there at 22. Can't you see that? Do you honestly believe that the team that has done THE worst job of drafting and performing for the past 40 years is really smarter than the rest of the NFL world?
Why not be excited but contain the boasting and trash talking until the organization and the new QB actually do something?
An Hoorta there are plenty of haters. There were guys rooted for the Browns to lose so Bill Belichick would be fired. I've seen guys wearing Miami and Dallas jerseys.
WSS
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People can't seem to get it through their heads that this is a new FO with many new players. There's no reason to think the Browns will suck again based on past events by people who are no longer around. The worst decisions of the past personnel have been taken care of.
However that being said, talk is cheap, prove it on the field.
As for the constant changes, well the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over expecting different results.
And since when have the Browns done the worst job drafting and performing for the past 40 years? Besides that's the magic number in the stories of the Bible, so I guess it's time for it to come to an end.
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People can't seem to get it through their heads that this is a new FO with many new players. There's no reason to think the Browns will suck again based on past events by people who are no longer around. The worst decisions of the past personnel have been taken care of.
However that being said, talk is cheap, prove it on the field.
As for the constant changes, well the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over expecting different results.
And since when have the Browns done the worst job drafting and performing for the past 40 years? Besides that's the magic number in the stories of the Bible, so I guess it's time for it to come to an end.
Lovingly Gay said:
People can't seem to get it through their heads that this is a new FO with many new players. There's no reason to think the Browns will suck again based on past events by people who are no longer around. The worst decisions of the past personnel have been taken care of. True.....but there is also no reason to believe that a group of people with zero experience will succeed.
Then I guess we are at a draw until we see how this season unfolds. But you can't expect a trip right to the SB first year out with new people either. Haslam was misdirected and on a learning curve his first time out as a sole NFL owner. He quickly uprighted the ship before it sunk, IMO. I don't expect non-Browns fans to see a difference in the changes, but you can be certain Browns fans feel the difference this time. Again, not expecting super-stardom right out of the gates.
However that being said, talk is cheap, prove it on the field. Exactly
As for the constant changes, well the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over expecting different results.
And since when have the Browns done the worst job drafting and performing for the past 40 years? Besides that's the magic number in the stories of the Bible, so I guess it's time for it to come to an end. Since the 1970 merger, which is just a point of reference no more no less, the Browns have the worst record and have drafted the highest (they might be second worst). Certainly true for the last 15 years.
Ok then. I'll accept a statement of the past 15 years (even if it might not be completely accurate, but you even admitted maybe second worst), but not 40 years as that's just wrong.
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i want johnny football because i want to see our qb taunt the opponent, make the money sign in ben rothelisburgers face and take a shit on andy daltons head
Sorry... can't edit the quotes so they separate... Microsoft strikes again...
i want johnny football because i want to see our qb taunt the opponent, make the money sign in ben rothelisburgers face and take a shit on andy daltons head
Because that's what it takes to win division games?@everlastingxxx said:
I think there is a serious lack of talent on the Browns offense. Its not just a QB problem. The good thing is you dont need need many points with the Browns D. A guy like Manziel can get you that last game winning drive.
Your whole premise screams for a game manager at QB... and that ain't JM...its baffling to me that hoyer automatically gets the job. He played decent in those 3 games, not amazing. 3 games should never solidify a starting spot. They should let the quarterbacks compete. Hoyers resume is nothing special so far in his career, if he beats out manziel by looking better than him im ok with that. But to tell johnny to act like a backup is bad. All backups should be preparing like they are starters.
[/quote/]
Hoyer has not "automatically gotten the job". He is simply the current #1 QB on the depth chart. Pattine has said the starting job will be a competition. Also said Manziel was "inconsistent" at yesterday's OTA and that was understandable because the system is so new to him. Farmer said that at this point Hoyer is far ahead.
"... Farmer said on Bull & Fox that Hoyer is the better quarterback 'by a substantial margin'."
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2014/05/21/ray-farmer-hoyer-is-better-than-manziel-by-a-substantial-margin/
But that's as of now... long time till Sept.Tough Division? If you have been watching TV, national commentators no longer consider the AFCN a "tough" division.
Ravens and Steelers are considered mediocre or below. There is really not much respect for the Bengals even though they are defending division champs. The Browns seem to be the most interesting and exciting team, with as much talent as any other, but haven't learned how to win.
Yup... Most early Vegas lines and many other sources project the AFCN as a whole to be mediocre with our "champion" winning 9 games and the other 3 teams at 8-8 or 7-9.
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
Sorry... can't edit the quotes so they separate... Microsoft strikes again...
i want johnny football because i want to see our qb taunt the opponent, make the money sign in ben rothelisburgers face and take a shit on andy daltons head
Because that's what it takes to win division games?@everlastingxxx said:
I think there is a serious lack of talent on the Browns offense. Its not just a QB problem. The good thing is you dont need need many points with the Browns D. A guy like Manziel can get you that last game winning drive.
Your whole premise screams for a game manager at QB... and that ain't JM...its baffling to me that hoyer automatically gets the job. He played decent in those 3 games, not amazing. 3 games should never solidify a starting spot. They should let the quarterbacks compete. Hoyers resume is nothing special so far in his career, if he beats out manziel by looking better than him im ok with that. But to tell johnny to act like a backup is bad. All backups should be preparing like they are starters.
[/quote/]
Hoyer has not "automatically gotten the job". He is simply the current #1 QB on the depth chart. Pattine has said the starting job will be a competition. Also said Manziel was "inconsistent" at yesterday's OTA and that was understandable because the system is so new to him. Farmer said that at this point Hoyer is far ahead.
"... Farmer said on Bull & Fox that Hoyer is the better quarterback 'by a substantial margin'."
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2014/05/21/ray-farmer-hoyer-is-better-than-manziel-by-a-substantial-margin/
But that's as of now... long time till Sept.Tough Division? If you have been watching TV, national commentators no longer consider the AFCN a "tough" division.
Ravens and Steelers are considered mediocre or below. There is really not much respect for the Bengals even though they are defending division champs. The Browns seem to be the most interesting and exciting team, with as much talent as any other, but haven't learned how to win.
Yup... Most early Vegas lines and many other sources project the AFCN as a whole to be mediocre with our "champion" winning 9 games and the other 3 teams at 8-8 or 7-9.
Sorry... can't edit the quotes so they separate... Microsoft strikes again...
You can't multiquote the responses?
I'm awesome, and I fuck dolphins. Ghoolie 12/2/2012: I have absolutely no skills, training or pride -
Boy, this thread is one big Cluster Fock. The chain of events that's happening is very very concerning. It is not the type of start you see for a QB that's going to be a star in this league.
Let's examine this.
1) Manziel was bypassed by the Browns twice.
2) A projected top 10 pick that went into a complete free fall. If it wasn't for Cleveland, god knows where he would had ended up.
3) Report is, Bridgewater was on the name of the card for the 22nd pick but only changed in the last second because of a Manziel 'WRECK THE LEAGUE TEXT'.
4) After getting drafted, Haslem comes out and say Manziel will be a backup and have to understand that Cleveland is a "HARDWORKING" town. Cleveland is NOT Hollywood. It certainly seems like Cleveland's biggest concern is Manziel's lacks hardwork and loves only the spotlight.
5) To confirm the lack of hardwork, a NE Patriots scouting report leaked shortly after the draft indicating Manziel lacks strong work ethic and is a party animal. He's also have issues in the locker room.
6) Starts off OTA the 3rd on the QB depth chart and have not practiced with the 1st string offense yet.
7) Today, Farmer indicates that Hoyer is FAR BETTER as a QB than Manziel.
You have be Manziel's jock to see there's no concerns here. This is NOT a good START to a bright NFL career.
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Or maybe Gordon isnt the whole fucking team.
WSS
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Masterdog-you have taken a few facts and spun them the way you want it to be seen. You have no idea how hard Johnny worked AFTER the Heisman to develop himself into a pocket passer. That paid off by having the highest completion rate in the country FROM THE POCKET in 2013. When he went to California to work with a QB coach he did two very important things. First he made it clear he wanted to become an NFL level QB who passed from the pocket first and then did his thing on the run second. The second thing he did is tell that coach that he would not enter the NFL draft until that coach told him he was ready to make the next step. Both of those goals were accomplished. I guarantee he has now set new goals for himself and has shared those with his new coaching staff. They in return have shared their expectations and will help him reach those mutually agreed upon goals before they throw him to the wolves.
In line with this I saw a live interview this morning with the HC in which he said, "I will not let our QB selection be decided by T-shirt sales." He will play Johnny in games only when he shows he is ready and is superior to any other QB on the roster. He also made it clear one week is not enough to decide anything.
PS-I must have missed it. When exactly did Farmer become the head coach?
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Masterdog-you have taken a few facts and spun them the way you want it to be seen. You have no idea how hard Johnny worked AFTER the Heisman to develop himself into a pocket passer. That paid off by having the highest completion rate in the country FROM THE POCKET in 2013. When he went to California to work with a QB coach he did two very important things. First he made it clear he wanted to become an NFL level QB who passed from the pocket first and then did his thing on the run second. The second thing he did is tell that coach that he would not enter the NFL draft until that coach told him he was ready to make the next step. Both of those goals were accomplished. I guarantee he has now set new goals for himself and has shared those with his new coaching staff. They in return have shared their expectations and will help him reach those mutually agreed upon goals before they throw him to the wolves.
In line with this I saw a live interview this morning with the HC in which he said, "I will not let our QB selection be decided by T-shirt sales." He will play Johnny in games only when he shows he is ready and is superior to any other QB on the roster. He also made it clear one week is not enough to decide anything.
PS-I must have missed it. When exactly did Farmer become the head coach?
Exactly Petine
Masterdog-you have taken a few facts and spun them the way you want it to be seen. You have no idea how hard Johnny worked AFTER the Heisman to develop himself into a pocket passer. That paid off by having the highest completion rate in the country FROM THE POCKET in 2013. When he went to California to work with a QB coach he did two very important things. First he made it clear he wanted to become an NFL level QB who passed from the pocket first and then did his thing on the run second. The second thing he did is tell that coach that he would not enter the NFL draft until that coach told him he was ready to make the next step. Both of those goals were accomplished. I guarantee he has now set new goals for himself and has shared those with his new coaching staff. They in return have shared their expectations and will help him reach those mutually agreed upon goals before they throw him to the wolves.
In line with this I saw a live interview this morning with the HC in which he said, "I will not let our QB selection be decided by T-shirt sales." He will play Johnny in games only when he shows he is ready and is superior to any other QB on the roster. He also made it clear one week is not enough to decide anything.
PS-I must have missed it. When exactly did Farmer become the head coach?
Exactly. They are trying to send smoke screens as usual about who will start, etc. They are well aware of the media circus surrounding Johnny Football and they will play it to their advantage.
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You can't multiquote the responses?
I did... for some reason (IE update and/or site software update) just started blending them all together. I can edit to separate them, but when I post, they merge again...
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
You can't multiquote the responses?
I did... for some reason (IE update and/or site software update) just started blending them all together. I can edit to separate them, but when I post, they merge again...
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@douche-nozzle said:
Do yourself a favor and read the SI article about the draft. The experts were very iffy on Johnny and there is a reason he was still available at 22, just like Quinn and Weeden were. And when Cleveland drafted them, they thought they got a steal then too!
There isn't a draft pick ever made that wasn't a risk. #1 overall picks the likes of Jamarcus Russell are a prone to "bustage" as any other position. Or you can have a street FA become a Hall of Famer.
Just because Weeden and Quinn were busts doesn't mean JFF will be. Of course it doesn't mean he won't.
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Masterdog-you have taken a few facts and spun them the way you want it to be seen. You have no idea how hard Johnny worked AFTER the Heisman to develop himself into a pocket passer. That paid off by having the highest completion rate in the country FROM THE POCKET in 2013. When he went to California to work with a QB coach he did two very important things. First he made it clear he wanted to become an NFL level QB who passed from the pocket first and then did his thing on the run second. The second thing he did is tell that coach that he would not enter the NFL draft until that coach told him he was ready to make the next step. Both of those goals were accomplished. I guarantee he has now set new goals for himself and has shared those with his new coaching staff. They in return have shared their expectations and will help him reach those mutually agreed upon goals before they throw him to the wolves.
In line with this I saw a live interview this morning with the HC in which he said, "I will not let our QB selection be decided by T-shirt sales." He will play Johnny in games only when he shows he is ready and is superior to any other QB on the roster. He also made it clear one week is not enough to decide anything.
PS-I must have missed it. When exactly did Farmer become the head coach?
Well... perhaps the multi-quote glitch is gone...
@douche-nozzle said:
Maybe the Browns finally have a front office? Maybe they intend to knock the Johnny Football out of Johnny Manziel and see what he really has? Maybe this front office knew about Gordon but decided to build a team beyond THIS YEAR? I for one am very interested to see if the Browns might finally have a front office. I'm also interested to see how many Browns fans organize a mass suicide because building for the future is unacceptable in Cleveland
Our FO has stated that the Gordon news had zero impact on the draft plan. Certainly in part because Gordon's future is up in the air and in part because they new they could rent WRs for a year, if need be.
As for our FOs... excepting the panic-stricken, Wheezy/TR fiasco that was Holmgren's dying breath, we haven't been doing too badly player-wise. And now, although I admit the jury is still out, I think it is pretty clear our FO is even better.
PS-I must have missed it. When exactly did Farmer become the head coach?
As you well know he is not. What is Farmer? Our talent-evaluator-in-chief... Seen any sign that our HC disagrees at this point?
To expect anything other than JM being no higher than #2 on the depth chart at this point is ludicrous.
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And since when have the Browns done the worst job drafting and performing for the past 40 years? Besides that's the magic number in the stories of the Bible, so I guess it's time for it to come to an end. Since the 1970 merger, which is just a point of reference no more no less, the Browns have the worst record and have drafted the highest (they might be second worst). Certainly true for the last 15 years.
Well, see, this is where your ignorance an hubris comes in. The Browns by no means have the worst record, nor have they probably had any greater ratio of busts with their drafts than many many other teams.
Even in the last 15 year teams like the Raiders, Jags, Lions have worse records.
I am sure I could come in with statistics blowing your generalizations out of the water, but I have determined that countering ignorant generalizations is not worth my time.
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