Stockton Shorts Discusses Brian Hoyer
-
Counter points... Russell Wilson, Aaron rogers, big gay Ben, tom Brady. All had great foundations, mainly a good/great d before they came in.
Its just not as easy as you're trying to make it or all NFL teams would have franchise qbs. I get your opinion but its easier said than done.
They absolutely built around Russell Wilson. They were going to start Matt Flynn because he was Rodgers backup and had experience, but Pete Carroll said no started a mobile rookie and let him learn on the job.
The defense was rebuilt the same year, the Seahawks were 7-9 the year before. The grew together and in the 2nd year of Wilson got a Super Bowl. They weren't great before Wilson.
Same with Big Ben. They were 6-10 the year before and he took over a 2-1 team. They grew together. Super Bowl in 2nd year.
Tom Brady, they were 5-11 the year before and he took over a 0-2 team. They weren't a great team. They became great together, Super Bowl in 1st year.
Aaron Rodgers they had a team that was 13-3 the year before. Rodgers sat on the bench for 4 years. They were loaded...the first year he played they went 6-10. They stripped that team down and built around Rodgers strengths, next year 11-5 and Super Bowl in his 3rd year.
You build around your QB. This idea that all these teams were built up and these QBs were eased in, is flat wrong. You get your QB and you build the team.
They absolutely built around Russell Wilson.
this right here proves you know dick about football. they didn't build around russell wilson. that team was stacked the second he went in the game.
Retard: the throbbing vein in the neck of every true brown's fan.
-
They absolutely built around Russell Wilson.
this right here proves you know dick about football. they didn't build around russell wilson. that team was stacked the second he went in the game.
Retard: the throbbing vein in the neck of every true brown's fan.
this right here proves you know dick about football. they didn't build around russell wilson. that team was stacked the second he went in the game.
Retard: the throbbing vein in the neck of every true brown's fan.
Yeah- he forgets the reason the Seahawks won that super Bowl- a defense studly enough to make Peyton Manning look like dog doo-doo, and Marshawn Lynch.
Russell Wilson? Every qb gets praised to heaven after a new Super Bowl win. Giants fans would like nothing better than to run Eli Manning out of town.
-
this right here proves you know dick about football. they didn't build around russell wilson. that team was stacked the second he went in the game.
Retard: the throbbing vein in the neck of every true brown's fan.
Yeah- he forgets the reason the Seahawks won that super Bowl- a defense studly enough to make Peyton Manning look like dog doo-doo, and Marshawn Lynch.
Russell Wilson? Every qb gets praised to heaven after a new Super Bowl win. Giants fans would like nothing better than to run Eli Manning out of town.
Giants fans would like nothing better than to run Eli Manning out of town.
that's what happens when you don't draft correctly. the giants have always been built around a stud OL with a serious running game and a stacked defense. like i said in another thread: take away that and any QB will look like brandon weeden on a bad day. without repairing any of it for 2 years now i think eli is shell shocked and would do both the team and himself a favor by going somewhere else.
-
Its probably because his agent kept leaking stuff to the media about his upcoming contract and who he wants off the team. Big time distractions.
-
Die please
Hey I agree with the coaches decisions, if I had guys in my locker room saying "If I'm not the starter I want out of here" and "I'll only play where I'm the clear starter" then I'd want him off the team ASAP. Can't have selfish players like that in your locker room.
-
Do you genuinely believe that Hoyer has said that to Farmer? That it's not, at most, his agent stirring shit? Because it definitely sounds like a lot of nonsense cooked up by the media that completely contradicts everything we know about Hoyer's persona.
Don't answer - this is a Tate thread and we shouldn't hijack it with other stuff. Feel free to reply somewhere else though.
Hoyer has said it himself to the media directly.
-
Yes, he did say he wanted to be in a place that he starts and the team trusts him.. Is that supposed to be bad?
Its bad when Tate says it. Right?
-
I would love to have Manning, rogers, Brees, or Brady as our qb. But we don't. We have an average game manager with a shoddy o line, Jekyll/Hyde defense, and a bunch of overachieving no name wrs.
Please enlighten us on how we can get these so called franchise qbs. Because only 5 people in the world currently seem to be a franchise qb.
We have an average qb, an unproven rookie who doesn't appear to be better than our average qb, and practice squad fodder.
You draft them.
Theres a lot more than 5 Franchise QBs.
Hoyer isn't one of them. The minute you realize that you have to move on. You're wasting time playing him.
We have two unproven Rookies at QB. At one time everyone of those Franchise QBs were unproven rookies. You know how they became Franchise QBs? They played.
That is how you find them USFBrown. You play them, and you see. We've played Hoyer and we see a guy who isn't a Franchise QB.
Theres a lot more than 5 Franchise QBs.
Then listing ten more should be no problem.
And go...
You build around your QB.
Wait... I thought great QBs were enough? That they could overcome deficiencies all around them... win unwinnable games... Not so? Whatever...
Name three teams that have successfully taken the "build around the QB" approach. Since there are so many franchise QBs, it should again be easy.
EDIT: Nevermind... saw your bullshit examples... Just more StockBoy handwaving at a different level.
-
Seems the trend lately has been getting a team and then plugging in the franchise guy.
See:
1.) Denver
2.) Seattle
3.) Chiefs
4.) Packers
5.) Indy?
6.) AZ?
Up next: Bengals?, Browns?, Chicago?, Houston?, Buffalo?
The teams who get a QB before everything else: Vikings, Jags, Raiders, Falcons
Regardless there's many right ways to build a team. Plugging "the guy" into a well built team seems to help them flourish more than plugging a guy into a more hapless team like the vikings, falcons, jags, jets, raiders
-
Quarterback is a like a boner in a whore house - you're only as good as your protection.
-
Seems the trend lately has been getting a team and then plugging in the franchise guy.
See:
1.) Denver
2.) Seattle
3.) Chiefs
4.) Packers
5.) Indy?
6.) AZ?
Up next: Bengals?, Browns?, Chicago?, Houston?, Buffalo?
The teams who get a QB before everything else: Vikings, Jags, Raiders, Falcons
Regardless there's many right ways to build a team. Plugging "the guy" into a well built team seems to help them flourish more than plugging a guy into a more hapless team like the vikings, falcons, jags, jets, raiders
Seems the trend lately has been getting a team and then plugging in the franchise guy.
See:
1.) Denver
2.) Seattle
3.) Chiefs
4.) Packers
5.) Indy?
6.) AZ?
Up next: Bengals?, Browns?, Chicago?, Houston?, Buffalo?
The teams who get a QB before everything else: Vikings, Jags, Raiders, Falcons
Regardless there's many right ways to build a team. Plugging "the guy" into a well built team seems to help them flourish more than plugging a guy into a more hapless team like the vikings, falcons, jags, jets, raiders
Good points.
The ones plugged into built teams get to safely perform out of the gate and do well.
The ones plugged into bad teams first and then "built around", usually get broken and then fail. The list is too long to even research or type. But some names that quickly come to mind are Tim Couch, David Carr, RGIII & Sam Bradford, who all died on the vine waiting for the "build".
It makes you wonder if BH isn't just the likable sacrificial lamb being used to build around, while protecting the prodigal son from any harm as he grows up.
-
Seems the trend lately has been getting a team and then plugging in the franchise guy.
See:
1.) Denver
2.) Seattle
3.) Chiefs
4.) Packers
5.) Indy?
6.) AZ?
Up next: Bengals?, Browns?, Chicago?, Houston?, Buffalo?
The teams who get a QB before everything else: Vikings, Jags, Raiders, Falcons
Regardless there's many right ways to build a team. Plugging "the guy" into a well built team seems to help them flourish more than plugging a guy into a more hapless team like the vikings, falcons, jags, jets, raiders
Seems the trend lately has been getting a team and then plugging in the franchise guy.
See:
1.) Denver
2.) Seattle
3.) Chiefs
4.) Packers
5.) Indy?
6.) AZ?
Up next: Bengals?, Browns?, Chicago?, Houston?, Buffalo?
The teams who get a QB before everything else: Vikings, Jags, Raiders, Falcons
Regardless there's many right ways to build a team. Plugging "the guy" into a well built team seems to help them flourish more than plugging a guy into a more hapless team like the vikings, falcons, jags, jets, raiders
Can't explain how dumb this list is.
Denver got Peyton Manning. They were going to be good either way.
Seattle was 7-9 before Wilson
Arizona (who I don't think belongs on this list) was 5-11 before Palmer
Indy was 2-14 before Luck
Chiefs were 2-14 before Smith
Packers are the best scenario, they were 13-3 before Rodgers, then 6-10 his first year (after sitting 4 years) and they had to rebuild the roster around him.
None of those teams were "Ready" teams before they got their QB (Except maybe Denver) They all grew with their QB. As did Atlanta (as someone tried to throw in Matt Ryan as "rushed too soon" that guy has been the #1 seed and in a NFC Championship. By this boards standards thats HOF quality).
-
Do you think Robert Griffin III is a good QB? How about Matt Schaub? Do you think they're good QBs? I don't.
However both those guys in their first full season in this EXACT same offense put up these numbers
RGIII 65.6% completions 20TDs 102.4 Rating
Schaub 67.9% completions 29TDs 98.6 Rating
Hoyer right now 55.7% completions 11TDs 86 Rating
Those other two QBs aren't even good. Schaub is a bum and RGIII doesn't even know any QB mechanics and they blew Hoyer out of the water in this system. Thats how bad Hoyer is. The most QB friendly system in the universe and he's dead last in completion % in the NFL in it.
"Oh but Stockton the run game" Shut up. The run game is failing because nobody is scared of Brian Hoyer. Teams loading up against the run only opens more opportunities up for the passing game, not less.
Put it this way, right now Tom Brady has the 31st ranked rushing O.
Andrew Luck has the 25th ranked rushing O.
Big Ben 19th.
Phillip Rivers 29th.Aaron Rodgers 13th.
Hell Arizona is 30th in rushing. Why are they not struggling?
And before you go "Well the offensive line..." I'll stop you there.
The Oline in RGIIIs first year was 23rd in Pass Protection.
In Schaubs year his Oline was 16th in pass protection.
Browns pass protection is 8th.
"But Stockton the Wide Receivers"
Right now the Browns have the second least drops in the entire NFL. Second LEAST.In RGIIIs rookie year, the Redskins LED THE LEAGUE IN DROPS. Led the entire NFL.
Hoyer is a Miller High Life in a Champagne League. -
Do you think Robert Griffin III is a good QB? How about Matt Schaub? Do you think they're good QBs? I don't.
However both those guys in their first full season in this EXACT same offense put up these numbers
RGIII 65.6% completions 20TDs 102.4 Rating
Schaub 67.9% completions 29TDs 98.6 Rating
Hoyer right now 55.7% completions 11TDs 86 Rating
Those other two QBs aren't even good. Schaub is a bum and RGIII doesn't even know any QB mechanics and they blew Hoyer out of the water in this system. Thats how bad Hoyer is. The most QB friendly system in the universe and he's dead last in completion % in the NFL in it.
"Oh but Stockton the run game" Shut up. The run game is failing because nobody is scared of Brian Hoyer. Teams loading up against the run only opens more opportunities up for the passing game, not less.
Put it this way, right now Tom Brady has the 31st ranked rushing O.
Andrew Luck has the 25th ranked rushing O.
Big Ben 19th.
Phillip Rivers 29th.Aaron Rodgers 13th.
Hell Arizona is 30th in rushing. Why are they not struggling?
And before you go "Well the offensive line..." I'll stop you there.
The Oline in RGIIIs first year was 23rd in Pass Protection.
In Schaubs year his Oline was 16th in pass protection.
Browns pass protection is 8th.
"But Stockton the Wide Receivers"
Right now the Browns have the second least drops in the entire NFL. Second LEAST.In RGIIIs rookie year, the Redskins LED THE LEAGUE IN DROPS. Led the entire NFL.
Hoyer is a Miller High Life in a Champagne League.
You can look at stats or you can look at a player's intangibles, your call. Nothing you can do when you have zero protection and cookie cutter recievers that can't make a play or get open unless they're set up perefectly.Do you think Robert Griffin III is a good QB? How about Matt Schaub? Do you think they're good QBs? I don't.
However both those guys in their first full season in this EXACT same offense put up these numbers
RGIII 65.6% completions 20TDs 102.4 Rating
Schaub 67.9% completions 29TDs 98.6 Rating
Hoyer right now 55.7% completions 11TDs 86 Rating
Those other two QBs aren't even good. Schaub is a bum and RGIII doesn't even know any QB mechanics and they blew Hoyer out of the water in this system. Thats how bad Hoyer is. The most QB friendly system in the universe and he's dead last in completion % in the NFL in it.
"Oh but Stockton the run game" Shut up. The run game is failing because nobody is scared of Brian Hoyer. Teams loading up against the run only opens more opportunities up for the passing game, not less.
Put it this way, right now Tom Brady has the 31st ranked rushing O.
Andrew Luck has the 25th ranked rushing O.
Big Ben 19th.
Phillip Rivers 29th.
Aaron Rodgers 13th.
Hell Arizona is 30th in rushing. Why are they not struggling?
And before you go "Well the offensive line..." I'll stop you there.
The Oline in RGIIIs first year was 23rd in Pass Protection.
In Schaubs year his Oline was 16th in pass protection.
Browns pass protection is 8th.
"But Stockton the Wide Receivers"
Right now the Browns have the second least drops in the entire NFL. Second LEAST.
In RGIIIs rookie year, the Redskins LED THE LEAGUE IN DROPS. Led the entire NFL.
Hoyer is a Miller High Life in a Champagne League.
PS: die
-
You can look at stats or you can look at a player's intangibles, your call. Nothing you can do when you have zero protection and cookie cutter recievers that can't make a play or get open unless they're set up perefectly.Do you think Robert Griffin III is a good QB? How about Matt Schaub? Do you think they're good QBs? I don't.
However both those guys in their first full season in this EXACT same offense put up these numbers
RGIII 65.6% completions 20TDs 102.4 Rating
Schaub 67.9% completions 29TDs 98.6 Rating
Hoyer right now 55.7% completions 11TDs 86 Rating
Those other two QBs aren't even good. Schaub is a bum and RGIII doesn't even know any QB mechanics and they blew Hoyer out of the water in this system. Thats how bad Hoyer is. The most QB friendly system in the universe and he's dead last in completion % in the NFL in it.
"Oh but Stockton the run game" Shut up. The run game is failing because nobody is scared of Brian Hoyer. Teams loading up against the run only opens more opportunities up for the passing game, not less.
Put it this way, right now Tom Brady has the 31st ranked rushing O.
Andrew Luck has the 25th ranked rushing O.
Big Ben 19th.
Phillip Rivers 29th.
Aaron Rodgers 13th.
Hell Arizona is 30th in rushing. Why are they not struggling?
And before you go "Well the offensive line..." I'll stop you there.
The Oline in RGIIIs first year was 23rd in Pass Protection.
In Schaubs year his Oline was 16th in pass protection.
Browns pass protection is 8th.
"But Stockton the Wide Receivers"
Right now the Browns have the second least drops in the entire NFL. Second LEAST.
In RGIIIs rookie year, the Redskins LED THE LEAGUE IN DROPS. Led the entire NFL.
Hoyer is a Miller High Life in a Champagne League.
PS: die
You can look at stats or a players intangibles, your call. Nothing you can do when you have zero protection and cookie cutter recievers that can't make a play or get open unless they're set up perefectly.
PS: die
Those issues were addressed in the post.
And please list these "intangibles".....
-
Do you think Robert Griffin III is a good QB? How about Matt Schaub? Do you think they're good QBs? I don't.
However both those guys in their first full season in this EXACT same offense put up these numbers
RGIII 65.6% completions 20TDs 102.4 Rating
Schaub 67.9% completions 29TDs 98.6 Rating
Hoyer right now 55.7% completions 11TDs 86 Rating
Those other two QBs aren't even good. Schaub is a bum and RGIII doesn't even know any QB mechanics and they blew Hoyer out of the water in this system. Thats how bad Hoyer is. The most QB friendly system in the universe and he's dead last in completion % in the NFL in it.
"Oh but Stockton the run game" Shut up. The run game is failing because nobody is scared of Brian Hoyer. Teams loading up against the run only opens more opportunities up for the passing game, not less.
Put it this way, right now Tom Brady has the 31st ranked rushing O.
Andrew Luck has the 25th ranked rushing O.
Big Ben 19th.
Phillip Rivers 29th.Aaron Rodgers 13th.
Hell Arizona is 30th in rushing. Why are they not struggling?
And before you go "Well the offensive line..." I'll stop you there.
The Oline in RGIIIs first year was 23rd in Pass Protection.
In Schaubs year his Oline was 16th in pass protection.
Browns pass protection is 8th.
"But Stockton the Wide Receivers"
Right now the Browns have the second least drops in the entire NFL. Second LEAST.In RGIIIs rookie year, the Redskins LED THE LEAGUE IN DROPS. Led the entire NFL.
Hoyer is a Miller High Life in a Champagne League."Oh but Stockton the run game" Shut up. The run game is failing because nobody is scared of Brian Hoyer. Teams loading up against the run only opens more opportunities up for the passing game, not less.
Please review the footage and post the box counts for at least one of the games where you believe this has occurred.
-
You can look at stats or a players intangibles, your call. Nothing you can do when you have zero protection and cookie cutter recievers that can't make a play or get open unless they're set up perefectly.
PS: die
Those issues were addressed in the post.
And please list these "intangibles".....
Those issues were addressed in the post.
And please list these "intangibles".....
Geat feel for the game, goes through his progressions, reads the field,good decisions, great touch, usually very accurate when his team allows him to get into a rhythm, knows how to switch up velocity on throws, great at hitting recievers I coverage squeezing it through tight windows, good technique, acceptable footwork. And his best attribute, his leadership and ability to get a team behind him. Makes his team better. And the dude is just a winner, always steps it up big time when we need him most. You can thank the protection and recievers' inability to do anything for his 4th quarter Sunday. Two completely different teams last year when hoyer was in and when weeden and Campbell were in. Only a handful of QB's could have been as succesful as hoyer up to this point in the season.
-
Those issues were addressed in the post.
And please list these "intangibles".....
Geat feel for the game, goes through his progressions, reads the field,good decisions, great touch, usually very accurate when his team allows him to get into a rhythm, knows how to switch up velocity on throws, great at hitting recievers I coverage squeezing it through tight windows, good technique, acceptable footwork. And his best attribute, his leadership and ability to get a team behind him. Makes his team better. And the dude is just a winner, always steps it up big time when we need him most. You can thank the protection and recievers' inability to do anything for his 4th quarter Sunday. Two completely different teams last year when hoyer was in and when weeden and Campbell were in. Only a handful of QB's could have been as succesful as hoyer up to this point in the season.
Geat feel for the game, goes through his progressions, reads the field,good decisions, great touch, usually very accurate when his team allows him to get into a rhythm, knows how to switch up velocity on throws, great at hitting recievers I coverage squeezing it through tight windows, good technique, acceptable footwork. And his best attribute, his leadership and ability to get a team behind him. Makes his team better. And the dude is just a winner, always steps it up big time when we need him most. You can thank the protection and recievers' inability to do anything for his 4th quarter Sunday. Two completely different teams last year when hoyer was in and when weeden and Campbell were in. Only a handful of QB's could have been as succesful as hoyer up to this point in the season.
There is nothing in this post that is supported by facts. Not a single thing. From the fact hes terribly inaccurate (worst in the NFL) always has been, and right to the point where he makes his "team better". Meanwhile in losses everyone is complaining about how the team didn't play well. How is that making the team "better"?
I agree there were a a couple drops in the 4th on Sunday. The INT wasn't Hoyers fault. Now what do you do to explain away his 3rd quarter that saw him go 2-11?
Why is it if you point out that Hoyer is stinking up the joing (51% 4TD 4INT sub 80 Rating last 5 games) You're "Not a true Browns fan" however its perfectly fine for everyone to throw the OLine (8th in pass protection) and the WRs core (2nd least drops in the NFL) under the bus and still be a "True Browns fan"?
Hello! It looks like you're interested in this conversation, but you don't have an account yet.
Getting fed up of having to scroll through the same posts each visit? When you register for an account, you'll always come back to exactly where you were before, and choose to be notified of new replies (either via email, or push notification). You'll also be able to save bookmarks and upvote posts to show your appreciation to other community members.
With your input, this post could be even better 💗
Register Login