Jameis Winston declares.

Tim Couch Pulls Out

@the-gipper said:
They draft 12th. They won't get a chance to get him. Of the 11 teams that draft before them like 8-9 need a QB.

This is that age-old question, though.

If, as you say, you would take him at 12, do you believe that he is franchise QB material?

Then, if you do believe he has franchise potential, where do you draw the line on trading up to get him?

If a franchise QB can really change a franchise by himself, wouldn't you do anything to get him?

These are all hypothetical. I am in no way saying that Winston is a franchise-changing quarterback. My questions are purely based on thought processes.

Tim Couch Pulls Out

I would also like to point out that the first mention of Jameis Winston on TheBrownsBoard was from yours truly:

@tim-couch-pulls-out said:
Richardson wasn't leading Cleveland to the playoffs any time soon. No runningback will be leading their team to the playoffs any time soon.

Adrian Peterson had an absolutely stellar season, where exactly did the Vikings end up?

If they use that draft pick and get a fantastic #2 CB or a wideout to pair with Gordon, this trade will have been great for us.

If they package two first round picks to move up two spots and take a QB, this trade will have been awful. We should be picking top 3 next year. There are, at this point, two very solid college QB's (Boyd, Bridgewater) and a beast DE (Clowney) that will be in the 2014 draft. There may also be a couple other good QB's available as well (Manziel, Hundley).

If we can't get a QB in that scenario, it's time to finally give up. Move the team to France and become the Baguettes.

Or we just trade back again and again and again and play for Jameis Winston, whenever he decides to come out. Could be three years from now.

Also, check out that bolded text.

I'll continue in my role as the most forward-thinker on this forum.

Westside Steve

Plus anybody in the Cleveland media that bad mouths him will be fired for racism.

WSS

Tim Couch Pulls Out

@westside-steve said:

Plus anybody in the Cleveland media that bad mouths him will be fired for racism.

WSS

Here's hoping that MKC is the first to go.

darkside5

@the-gipper said:
They draft 12th. They won't get a chance to get him. Of the 11 teams that draft before them like 8-9 need a QB.

The team that does draft him will still need a QB.

GO BROWNS !

BaconHound

Cleveland would have to give up both #1's and next years for Tampa's pick.

Don't see 11-5 in 2015 with the current roster and Winston

USFBrown

@junkyard-dawg said:

For a criminal rapist scumbag? No thanks.

+1. Id rather continue to have losing seasons than have a piece of shit leading my team.

The Cysko Kid

@clevfan4life said:

oh yes it can. Winston makes Manziel look like a Viennese choir boy.

The difference is he also makes manziel look like the equipment manager. Because jameis can play.

TopDawg31

@usfbrown said:
+1. Id rather continue to have losing seasons than have a piece of shit leading my team.

we already have a piece of shit that will lead this team next season, might as well get a bigger piece of shit to lead us. Anyway not going to happen, the bounty will be too high to get to #1 unless JFF + Gordon + 2 #1's = this years #1.

Itoldyou

@walterwhite said:
I wouldn't draft that fucking idiot if he made it all the way to 12

You call him an idiot yet he was accepted to Stanford. He holds a 3.2 GPA and can read defenses.

You are the same dirt bag that was all about sucking some Manziel rod so I am not surprised you can't see good QBs.

@junkyard-dawg said:

For a criminal rapist scumbag? No thanks.

Talking football no one cares about your made up vendetta.

The Gipper

@baconhound said:

Cleveland would have to give up both #1's and next years for Tampa's pick.

Don't see 11-5 in 2015 with the current roster and Winston

Right. The cost would be way too high imo to trade for him. Someone will want an RGIII type of deal. Nyet.

andeftw

I say draft him if the price is right. Then put a security team with him at all times like the Cowboys do with Dez Bryant.

As a matter of fact, get a security team to follow Manziel and most likely you won't have any more off-the-field issues with guy.

Mudfly

@andeftw said:

I say draft him if the price is right. Then put a security team with him at all times like the Cowboys do with Dez Bryant.

As a matter of fact, get a security team to follow Manziel and most likely you won't have any more off-the-field issues with guy.

Would be nice if you could....but you cant.

CBA basically forces a hands off situation with teams and players during the off season. The Browns cannot create rules, structure or a "security team" for Johnny.....he's on his own 100%.....

Tour2ma

@tim-couch-pulls-out said:
I'll continue in my role as the most forward-thinker on this forum.

All you need is a good talent appraiser to go with your foresight... or was Boyd just ahead of his time as well?

@baconhound said:
Don't see 11-5 in 2015 with the current roster and Winston

But what do you see with the current roster?

@mudfly said:
CBA basically forces a hands off situation with teams and players during the off season. The Browns cannot create rules, structure or a "security team" for Johnny.....he's on his own 100%.....

But all players were given individually tailored, off-season study plans and work out programs. Surely he'll follow those with at least the dedication he showed in season... Won't he?

andeftw

@mudfly said:

Would be nice if you could....but you cant.

CBA basically forces a hands off situation with teams and players during the off season. The Browns cannot create rules, structure or a "security team" for Johnny.....he's on his own 100%.....

So why can the Cowboys do so? Is it because Dez's rookie deal was signed before the new CBA was negotiated and signed?

Edit: I was looking into the reported 'rules' and it seems like they were set up before the 2012 season. Bryant had already played two seasons by then so it can't be a clause in his contract. If the new CBA has some clauses preventing an agreement of this kind from being valid, it wouldn't still be in place. I don't see why the Browns can't ask Johnny and his representatives to set up something like this.

BaconHound

@tour2ma said:

All you need is a good talent appraiser to go with your foresight... or was Boyd just ahead of his time as well?

But what do you see with the current roster?

But all players were given individually tailored, off-season study plans and work out programs. Surely he'll follow those with at least the dedication he showed in season... Won't he?

I will admit I'm a QB is the last piece kinda fan. If you tell me that you can build a top 10 defense, with a good offensive line and a solid run game I don't care if a Trent Dilfer type is the play caller. I always think that strategy is more bearable then the "trying to draft the QB savior".

andeftw

@baconhound said:

I will admit I'm a QB is the last piece kinda fan. If you tell me that you can build a top 10 defense, with a good offensive line and a solid run game I don't care if a Trent Dilfer type is the play caller. I always think that strategy is more bearable then the "trying to draft the QB savior".

That is a way to go about it, but it would have been more effective a few years ago. What happens when you get to the playoffs and that top defense faces a top 10 offense? Something has to give at some point, and you can't expect the defense to shot out top offenses in three straight games to get you the Lombardi.

You saw it happen in Week 17 and last week. The Detroit Lions, a top five defense, gave up 30 points to the Packers and 24 the following week to the Cowboys. At some point the offense will have to step up and put up more than 20 points per game.

The savior is the guy who makes the difference at that point.

Mudfly

@andeftw said:

So why can the Cowboys do so? Is it because Dez's rookie deal was signed before the new CBA was negotiated and signed?

Edit: I was looking into the reported 'rules' and it seems like they were set up before the 2012 season. Bryant had already played two seasons by then so it can't be a clause in his contract. If the new CBA has some clauses preventing an agreement of this kind from being valid, it wouldn't still be in place. I don't see why the Browns can't ask Johnny and his representatives to set up something like this.

I honestly dont know all the details on the Dez bryant thing...but from what Ive read this was something he volunteered to do after getting in trouble and negotiated while facing discipline from the league. So, it looks more like a negotiated punishment, rather than the team just saying they were gonna watch his every move....Plus, I do believe it applies only during training camp and the regular season....

Technically, I dont think JFF's gotten into any serious trouble like that, nor is he facing discipline, so it's very different....

What I do know is that teams cant force any players to do anything during the off season...and I would guess they've "asked" Johnny to do...or stop doing.....a lot of things......just cant force him to

andeftw

@mudfly said:

I honestly dont know all the details on the Dez bryant thing...but from what Ive read this was something he volunteered to do after getting in trouble and negotiated while facing discipline from the league. So, it looks more like a negotiated punishment, rather than the team just saying they were gonna watch his every move....Plus, I do believe it applies only during training camp and the regular season....

Technically, I dont think JFF's gotten into any serious trouble like that, nor is he facing discipline, so it's very different....

What I do know is that teams cant force any players to do anything during the off season...and I would guess they've "asked" Johnny to do...or stop doing.....a lot of things......just cant force him to

Right, but that's exactly the point I'm making. Ask the guy if he's willing to make these concessions to show you that he is committed to being the face of your franchise. Whether or not he works out on the field is a different story, but I'm pretty sure it can't hurt his preparation.

As much as it pains me to say it, being a Johnny fan from his time at A&M, If the guy refuses, continues to tour the country on a party bus and shows up to OTAs unprepared, then you have your answer and you might as well cut bait or try to salvage some draft capital through a trade.

Mudfly

Yeah...I get it....totally

I think , in the end, that it's VERY clear to Johnny that he needs to straighten up....and it's very clear that he's not really open to changing.....and Im sure that, while they haven't put security on him, the Browns have talked to him extensively about ways to improve his habits and off season structures etc etc etc....(probably pleaded with him)

But..... as he has said more than once...he's not changing for anybody. He's gonna live how he wants. He doesn't see anything wrong with a little fun...etc etc.... And his actions continue to say just that....

So, It's on Jff just to grow up.....and If he needs guards and security to succeed, then I agree it's definitely time to cut chase and trade him.......but, then, Ive been game for THAT all along