Browns vs. Steeler LB corps
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Maybe.....but he has a long, long, long, long, long way to catch up with yinz.
Gipper you spend a lot of time researching stuff. Please dig up some stupid things I've said that couldn't be backed up.
Gipper you spend a lot of time researching stuff. Please dig up some stupid things I've said that couldn't be backed up.
He does not have to.. You provide all the Ammo he needs on your own LOL!
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He does not have to.. You provide all the Ammo he needs on your own LOL!
Not the point chubby checker.
AKA SNATCH98 or Rorbotron. The boards glorious admins decided to get cute and change my name to "homotron" Classy group of people. (Lost a bet with Columbus king and got banned for a month) -
Maybe.....but he has a long, long, long, long, long way to catch up with yinz.
Gipper you spend a lot of time researching stuff. Please dig up some stupid things I've said that couldn't be backed up.
Gipper you spend a lot of time researching stuff. Please dig up some stupid things I've said that couldn't be backed up.
Just go back and look at 99% of your posts. I see this more of an opportunity for you to do some self reflection.
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Just go back and look at 99% of your posts. I see this more of an opportunity for you to do some self reflection.
I don't spout off blindly Gipper. I don't need to do self reflecting. You and others have been calling for the fall of the steelers for as long as I've been on the board.
AKA SNATCH98 or Rorbotron. The boards glorious admins decided to get cute and change my name to "homotron" Classy group of people. (Lost a bet with Columbus king and got banned for a month) -
Maybe.....but he has a long, long, long, long, long way to catch up with yinz.
And, you never know....under the Browns new OC maybe those guys can come close to duplicating in their secons season what Bell did in his second in receiving.
Depends on the offense and the quality of the QB throwing it to him.
It really doesn't. Bell runs receiver quality routes. He would put up ridiculous numbers in Cleveland too.
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Just go back and look at 99% of your posts. I see this more of an opportunity for you to do some self reflection.
I don't spout off blindly Gipper. I don't need to do self reflecting. You and others have been calling for the fall of the steelers for as long as I've been on the board.
I don't spout off blindly Gipper. I don't need to do self reflecting. You and others have been calling for the fall of the steelers for as long as I've been on the board.
A psychologist would say your lack of insight iand understandin into your issues is your first failure.
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A psychologist would say your lack of insight iand understandin into your issues is your first failure.
Lack of insight? Hilarious. Running backs and in most cases tight ends are safety valves for qbs experienced or inexperienced. It is completely different when talking about receivers. Bell would be good anywhere and Brown for the sake of argument is a phenom after the catch. Either would excel with every team in the league. Short dump offs = profit.
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A psychologist would say your lack of insight iand understandin into your issues is your first failure.
Lack of insight? Hilarious. Running backs and in most cases tight ends are safety valves for qbs experienced or inexperienced. It is completely different when talking about receivers. Bell would be good anywhere and Brown for the sake of argument is a phenom after the catch. Either would excel with every team in the league. Short dump offs = profit.
Lack of insight? Hilarious. Running backs and in most cases tight ends are safety valves for qbs experienced or inexperienced. It is completely different when talking about receivers. Bell would be good anywhere and Brown for the sake of argument is a phenom after the catch. Either would excel with every team in the league. Short dump offs = profit.
Nonresponsiveness is another symptom of psychosis. Nevertheless.....are you saying that Bell got almost all his yards pass catching on short dumpoffs? 832 yards worth?
If it is so easy to do for any half assed QB even, then why didn't the Browns do much of it? Our two guys combined got what? 150 yards? And Ben Tate only had 9 catches for 60 yards.
So? Why is your one RB getting 832 yards receiving and our 3 guys getting just over 200 combined?
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Lack of insight? Hilarious. Running backs and in most cases tight ends are safety valves for qbs experienced or inexperienced. It is completely different when talking about receivers. Bell would be good anywhere and Brown for the sake of argument is a phenom after the catch. Either would excel with every team in the league. Short dump offs = profit.
Nonresponsiveness is another symptom of psychosis. Nevertheless.....are you saying that Bell got almost all his yards pass catching on short dumpoffs? 832 yards worth?
If it is so easy to do for any half assed QB even, then why didn't the Browns do much of it? Our two guys combined got what? 150 yards? And Ben Tate only had 9 catches for 60 yards.
So? Why is your one RB getting 832 yards receiving and our 3 guys getting just over 200 combined?
Bell runs receiver quality routes to get open and he's much better at catching the football than west and crowell. Just as he's much better in the open field. He certainly didn't only catch short dump offs but his yards after catch I would assume were substantial.Nonresponsiveness is another symptom of psychosis. Nevertheless.....are you saying that Bell got almost all his yards pass catching on short dumpoffs? 832 yards worth?
If it is so easy to do for any half assed QB even, then why didn't the Browns do much of it? Our two guys combined got what? 150 yards? And Ben Tate only had 9 catches for 60 yards.
So? Why is your one RB getting 832 yards receiving and our 3 guys getting just over 200 combined?
Edit:http://espn.go.com/nfl/statistics/player/_/stat/receiving/sort/receivingYardsAfterCatch
Bell was second only to Matt forte.
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Bell runs receiver quality routes to get open and he's much better at catching the football than west and crowell. Just as he's much better in the open field. He certainly didn't only catch short dump offs but his yards after catch I would assume were substantial.Nonresponsiveness is another symptom of psychosis. Nevertheless.....are you saying that Bell got almost all his yards pass catching on short dumpoffs? 832 yards worth?
If it is so easy to do for any half assed QB even, then why didn't the Browns do much of it? Our two guys combined got what? 150 yards? And Ben Tate only had 9 catches for 60 yards.
So? Why is your one RB getting 832 yards receiving and our 3 guys getting just over 200 combined?
Edit:http://espn.go.com/nfl/statistics/player/_/stat/receiving/sort/receivingYardsAfterCatch
Bell was second only to Matt forte.
Bell runs receiver quality routes to get open and he's much better at catching the football than west and crowell. Just as he's much better in the open field. He certainly didn't only catch short dump offs but his yards after catch I would assume were substantial.
Edit:http://espn.go.com/nfl/statistics/player/_/stat/receiving/sort/receivingYardsAfterCatch
Bell was second only to Matt forte.
Well, that he is better may be a product of the time of offense they ran. The Browns guys have hardly had the opportunity to do the same. Bell certainly has been more productive in the pass game.....because imo, to a certain extent, the Steelers offense is heavily tailored to getting him the ball in open space. Which is good. You have something that works, use it.
One of my criticisms of Shanahan's offense last year was that he NEVER seemed to want the RBs to be much of a part of the receiving game. It seemed to me that it was only on rare occasion that the RB was used as an outlet receiver. And screen passes to our RBs was almost non-existant. As noted earlier, Tate had only 9 receptions, Crowell had only 9, West only 11. 29 catches vs. 83 for Bell. That number goes beyond talent. It was definitely Shanahan's purpose to de-emphasize RBs in the pass game.
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Bell runs receiver quality routes to get open and he's much better at catching the football than west and crowell. Just as he's much better in the open field. He certainly didn't only catch short dump offs but his yards after catch I would assume were substantial.
Edit:http://espn.go.com/nfl/statistics/player/_/stat/receiving/sort/receivingYardsAfterCatch
Bell was second only to Matt forte.
Well, that he is better may be a product of the time of offense they ran. The Browns guys have hardly had the opportunity to do the same. Bell certainly has been more productive in the pass game.....because imo, to a certain extent, the Steelers offense is heavily tailored to getting him the ball in open space. Which is good. You have something that works, use it.
One of my criticisms of Shanahan's offense last year was that he NEVER seemed to want the RBs to be much of a part of the receiving game. It seemed to me that it was only on rare occasion that the RB was used as an outlet receiver. And screen passes to our RBs was almost non-existant. As noted earlier, Tate had only 9 receptions, Crowell had only 9, West only 11. 29 catches vs. 83 for Bell. That number goes beyond talent. It was definitely Shanahan's purpose to de-emphasize RBs in the pass game.
You reach, reach, reach until you can find something to hang your bs on...watch bell's highlights. He creates the space and Haley does a nice job.Well, that he is better may be a product of the time of offense they ran. The Browns guys have hardly had the opportunity to do the same. Bell certainly has been more productive in the pass game.....because imo, to a certain extent, the Steelers offense is heavily tailored to getting him the ball in open space. Which is good. You have something that works, use it.
One of my criticisms of Shanahan's offense last year was that he NEVER seemed to want the RBs to be much of a part of the receiving game. It seemed to me that it was only on rare occasion that the RB was used as an outlet receiver. And screen passes to our RBs was almost non-existant. As noted earlier, Tate had only 9 receptions, Crowell had only 9, West only 11. 29 catches vs. 83 for Bell. That number goes beyond talent. It was definitely Shanahan's purpose to de-emphasize RBs in the pass game.
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You reach, reach, reach until you can find something to hang your bs on...watch bell's highlights. He creates the space and Haley does a nice job.Well, that he is better may be a product of the time of offense they ran. The Browns guys have hardly had the opportunity to do the same. Bell certainly has been more productive in the pass game.....because imo, to a certain extent, the Steelers offense is heavily tailored to getting him the ball in open space. Which is good. You have something that works, use it.
One of my criticisms of Shanahan's offense last year was that he NEVER seemed to want the RBs to be much of a part of the receiving game. It seemed to me that it was only on rare occasion that the RB was used as an outlet receiver. And screen passes to our RBs was almost non-existant. As noted earlier, Tate had only 9 receptions, Crowell had only 9, West only 11. 29 catches vs. 83 for Bell. That number goes beyond talent. It was definitely Shanahan's purpose to de-emphasize RBs in the pass game.
You reach, reach, reach until you can find something to hang your bs on...watch bell's highlights. He creates the space and Haley does a nice job.
You are completely missing the point. I know they do a fine job of executing the plays that are called for them.
....but Bell is not the one calling those plays, is he? The last time I noticed, BR was the Steelers QB.....and for Bell to get 83 catches, he has to have a QB willing to throw it to him 83 times.....and an OC willing to call those plays. Maybe they call those plays because they are confident in Bell's ability to make those plays...and that is fine.
But my point is that the Browns did NOT scheme to get the ball in the hands of their RBs in the pass game.....which to me was one of the flaws in the Browns offense. They ignored potential weapons...potential options. I think it went far beyond a lack of confidence in the rookies to catch the ball. Shanahan just didn't want to call those plays. More often than not he would not even allow the RB to go out as an outlet receiver....making them stay in to block if they weren't getting the ball.
Maybe our new OC will revise that scheme.
Why do you want to talk about apples when I am talking about oranges?
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You reach, reach, reach until you can find something to hang your bs on...watch bell's highlights. He creates the space and Haley does a nice job.
You are completely missing the point. I know they do a fine job of executing the plays that are called for them.
....but Bell is not the one calling those plays, is he? The last time I noticed, BR was the Steelers QB.....and for Bell to get 83 catches, he has to have a QB willing to throw it to him 83 times.....and an OC willing to call those plays. Maybe they call those plays because they are confident in Bell's ability to make those plays...and that is fine.
But my point is that the Browns did NOT scheme to get the ball in the hands of their RBs in the pass game.....which to me was one of the flaws in the Browns offense. They ignored potential weapons...potential options. I think it went far beyond a lack of confidence in the rookies to catch the ball. Shanahan just didn't want to call those plays. More often than not he would not even allow the RB to go out as an outlet receiver....making them stay in to block if they weren't getting the ball.
Maybe our new OC will revise that scheme.
Why do you want to talk about apples when I am talking about oranges?
You are completely missing the point. I know they do a fine job of executing the plays that are called for them.
....but Bell is not the one calling those plays, is he? The last time I noticed, BR was the Steelers QB.....and for Bell to get 83 catches, he has to have a QB willing to throw it to him 83 times.....and an OC willing to call those plays. Maybe they call those plays because they are confident in Bell's ability to make those plays...and that is fine.
But my point is that the Browns did NOT scheme to get the ball in the hands of their RBs in the pass game.....which to me was one of the flaws in the Browns offense. They ignored potential weapons...potential options. I think it went far beyond a lack of confidence in the rookies to catch the ball. Shanahan just didn't want to call those plays. More often than not he would not even allow the RB to go out as an outlet receiver....making them stay in to block if they weren't getting the ball.
Maybe our new OC will revise that scheme.
Why do you want to talk about apples when I am talking about oranges?
Hoyer was always bombing the ball deep, if shanahan really didn't want to scheme to the HB's that in your opinion are other worldly then he's a terrible offensive coordinator. I just don't think either crowell or west are very proficient through the air. If its neither of those things then its on hoyer for jot being very good and requiring the extra blocker a majority of the time. I also think its hilarious you are even trying to draw comparisons between two hbs vs one. I guess that means we should be able to just double bells production and then compare stats.
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You are completely missing the point. I know they do a fine job of executing the plays that are called for them.
....but Bell is not the one calling those plays, is he? The last time I noticed, BR was the Steelers QB.....and for Bell to get 83 catches, he has to have a QB willing to throw it to him 83 times.....and an OC willing to call those plays. Maybe they call those plays because they are confident in Bell's ability to make those plays...and that is fine.
But my point is that the Browns did NOT scheme to get the ball in the hands of their RBs in the pass game.....which to me was one of the flaws in the Browns offense. They ignored potential weapons...potential options. I think it went far beyond a lack of confidence in the rookies to catch the ball. Shanahan just didn't want to call those plays. More often than not he would not even allow the RB to go out as an outlet receiver....making them stay in to block if they weren't getting the ball.
Maybe our new OC will revise that scheme.
Why do you want to talk about apples when I am talking about oranges?
Hoyer was always bombing the ball deep, if shanahan really didn't want to scheme to the HB's that in your opinion are other worldly then he's a terrible offensive coordinator. I just don't think either crowell or west are very proficient through the air. If its neither of those things then its on hoyer for jot being very good and requiring the extra blocker a majority of the time. I also think its hilarious you are even trying to draw comparisons between two hbs vs one. I guess that means we should be able to just double bells production and then compare stats.
Hoyer was always bombing the ball deep, if shanahan really didn't want to scheme to the HB's that in your opinion are other worldly then he's a terrible offensive coordinator.
See, now I think we agree on something.
I just don't think either crowell or west are very proficient through the air.
Well, I just think we don't have a clue whether they were or not. You certainly don't know any better than we do if those guys could do a good job of catching out of the backfield.
If its neither of those things then its on hoyer for jot being very good and requiring the extra blocker a majority of the time.
Maybe some....Hoyer certainly went into the fetal position the latter half of the season.....but I think it is more Shanahan.
I also think its hilarious you are even trying to draw comparisons between two hbs vs one. I guess that means we should be able to just double bells production and then compare stats.
Well, this is why you lack credibility. If you notice, the W/C combo had almost the exact number of carries that Bell had. They shared the duties in the latter part of the year.......where Bell was the main carrier for the Steelers. The Steelers didn't have the RB by committee thing going that the Browns did.
But here are the stats for the two teams combined running game. For the Browns it combines Tate, West, Crowell, for the Steelers it combines Cheech and Chong, you know Bell and Blount. While each team had a few smattering of run plays run by QBs and others, nearly all the rushing game came from the 3 from Cleve. and the two from Pitt:
Browns combined stats (3 players) 425 carries 1613 yards 16 TDs, 3.6 ypc, 108.0 ypg
Steelers combined stats(2 players) 355 carries 1627 yards 10 TDs 4.1 ypc, 109.5 ypg.
As was noted earlier, Browns and Steelers had close to the same run game. 14 yards difference the entire year, 1.5 ypg. Steelers did have the better ypc....Browns had more rushing TDs.
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The Steelers offensive advantage was in the passing game. (gee, imagine that give the respective QBs):
Steelers: 411 of 612 attempts. 67.2% compl. rate. 4997 yards. 33 TDs, 10 Ints. 8.2 ypa. 312.3 ypg. 103.2 rating 33 sacks
Browns: 274 of 502 54.6% compl. rate 3678 yards 12 TDs, 16 Ints. 7.3 ypa, 229.9 ypg. 72.8 rating 31 sacks
Quarterbacks matter.
(almost identical running game. Browns Somewhat better OL. Almost equal LB corps. D Line....jury out. I don't think I even need to go into the Defensive Backfield.....Browns are simply better).
Quarterbacks matter ....and yes, organizational stability.
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Hoyer was always bombing the ball deep, if shanahan really didn't want to scheme to the HB's that in your opinion are other worldly then he's a terrible offensive coordinator.
See, now I think we agree on something.
I just don't think either crowell or west are very proficient through the air.
Well, I just think we don't have a clue whether they were or not. You certainly don't know any better than we do if those guys could do a good job of catching out of the backfield.
If its neither of those things then its on hoyer for jot being very good and requiring the extra blocker a majority of the time.
Maybe some....Hoyer certainly went into the fetal position the latter half of the season.....but I think it is more Shanahan.
I also think its hilarious you are even trying to draw comparisons between two hbs vs one. I guess that means we should be able to just double bells production and then compare stats.
Well, this is why you lack credibility. If you notice, the W/C combo had almost the exact number of carries that Bell had. They shared the duties in the latter part of the year.......where Bell was the main carrier for the Steelers. The Steelers didn't have the RB by committee thing going that the Browns did.
But here are the stats for the two teams combined running game. For the Browns it combines Tate, West, Crowell, for the Steelers it combines Cheech and Chong, you know Bell and Blount. While each team had a few smattering of run plays run by QBs and others, nearly all the rushing game came from the 3 from Cleve. and the two from Pitt:
Browns combined stats (3 players) 425 carries 1613 yards 16 TDs, 3.6 ypc, 108.0 ypg
Steelers combined stats(2 players) 355 carries 1627 yards 10 TDs 4.1 ypc, 109.5 ypg.
As was noted earlier, Browns and Steelers had close to the same run game. 14 yards difference the entire year, 1.5 ypg. Steelers did have the better ypc....Browns had more rushing TDs.
Gipper that isn't the damn point. You are comparing two sets of legs, two entirely different players that stayed fresh throughout the season because they weren't carrying a full time load to ONE player. You don't see the flawed logic here? Bell out performed two players and slaughtered them in the pass game. Do you think west as the full time ball carrier would have put up the same numbers as bell? Or Crowell for that matter? If that's the case the browns have one hell of a bargaining chip this upcoming draft and you should expect one to be traded. -
We aren't arguing success of the running game. What was being argued is that bell is the best in the NFL. It seems you are the one chasing something no one was chasing.
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We aren't arguing success of the running game. What was being argued is that bell is the best in the NFL. It seems you are the one chasing something no one was chasing.
We aren't arguing success of the running game. What was being argued is that bell is the best in the NFL. It seems you are the one chasing something no one was chasing.
Do you read what is being written? thenew23 said that West/Crowell combined were nearly as good as Bell.
Do you forget that you moaned and groaned and whined and cried over that statement........yet I proved statiscially that thenew23 was essentially right.....that those 2 combined had nearly the same carries/yardage/more TD....
Again, and again and again, you throw a tantrum....and then deny. How old are you? Because you act like you are like 4.
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We aren't arguing success of the running game. What was being argued is that bell is the best in the NFL. It seems you are the one chasing something no one was chasing.
Do you read what is being written? thenew23 said that West/Crowell combined were nearly as good as Bell.
Do you forget that you moaned and groaned and whined and cried over that statement........yet I proved statiscially that thenew23 was essentially right.....that those 2 combined had nearly the same carries/yardage/more TD....
Again, and again and again, you throw a tantrum....and then deny. How old are you? Because you act like you are like 4.
Do you read what is being written? thenew23 said that West/Crowell combined were nearly as good as Bell.
Do you forget that you moaned and groaned and whined and cried over that statement........yet I proved statiscially that thenew23 was essentially right.....that those 2 combined had nearly the same carries/yardage/more TD....
Again, and again and again, you throw a tantrum....and then deny. How old are you? Because you act like you are like 4.
Yes Gipper and its a flawed fucking argument. Who compares the production of two players to the production of one? Bell is better than both backs combined. He's certainly better than either one on one.
AKA SNATCH98 or Rorbotron. The boards glorious admins decided to get cute and change my name to "homotron" Classy group of people. (Lost a bet with Columbus king and got banned for a month)
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