Goff Or Lynch @2?
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Agree. Put Andy Dalton on the Browns and he would have been cut after 2 years.
Does a Brady Quinn or Brandon Weeden become a star with the Bengals and take them to the playoffs five straight years?
I lean more toward we have drafted shitty QBs than our shitty team has ruined QBs.
Zombo
Andy Dalton's been there for what, 4 years, right?Zombo said:
Does a Brady Quinn or Brandon Weeden become a star with the Bengals and take them to the playoffs five straight years?
I lean more toward we have drafted shitty QBs than our shitty team has ruined QBs.
Zombo
Mare Lewis?
WSS
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Andy Dalton's been there for what, 4 years, right?Zombo said:
Does a Brady Quinn or Brandon Weeden become a star with the Bengals and take them to the playoffs five straight years?
I lean more toward we have drafted shitty QBs than our shitty team has ruined QBs.
Zombo
Mare Lewis?
WSS
Andy Dalton's been there for what, 4 years, right?
Mare Lewis?
WSS
5 years, 5 playoffs.
Do you think if Quinn or Weeden was drafted onto Marv Lewis' team instead of ours they would have the same success?
Zombo
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That's all anyone needs to know. The Browns will buy it from there and waste another pick on an "ok" QB who gets us hyped up to take him instead of BPA.
"Hide behind the chainsaws" fools us every f'n time.
I'd agree with you except for the fact that Goff isn't "ok." That was Brandon Weeden, Johnny Manziel, Colt McCoy, Brady Quinn, Luke McCown.
The thing about those guys is - everybody knew they were "ok" (or bad) except for us on draft day. Everybody else knew what we didn't. (Ok, McCoy and McCown were fine wagers with low picks - but the others were not first-round quality and everybody knew it)
Weeden was going to fall well into the 2nd round, but we're dumb and liked him when no other team did. Manziel was slated to fall further than every other top QB prospect (Bortles/Bridgewater/Carr/Garrapolo may have ALL been taken before Johnny except for the fact that we're a bunch of idiots who ignore scouting reports for text messages), Quinn was regarded among the best in a crappy QB class - and everybody was surprised when he kept falling, falling, and falling. Then the dumbass Browns took him after it was apparent nobody wanted him.
You don't pass on a franchise QB for a DE - just doesn't happen, Goff will be a franchise QB somewhere.
And the DE we're talking about isn't JJ Watt here. It's so much easier to draft every other position than it is to draft a franchise QB, so we won't pass up on the one that's sitting on top of everybody's draft board.
You don't pass on a franchise QB for a DE - just doesn't happen, Goff will be a franchise QB somewhere.
Agree... Goff's floor is franchise level... book it. I can't remember the last draft when I said that of a QB prospect. (Luck? Yes, but I thought his floor was higher than "franchise".) Draft position is all about odds and Goff rings the bell.
But even that is not enough to take him top five or even top ten. What makes him Top Two is he has upside... he is franchise-plus.
Here's his DraftBreakdown page with six-2015 games. For those who would pass on him... spend some time... see for yourselves... if you have not already.
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
I've had same opinion as bbedward for a while now, I think he's the best prospect since luck, everyone is entitled their own.
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Andy Dalton's been there for what, 4 years, right?
Mare Lewis?
WSS
5 years, 5 playoffs.
Do you think if Quinn or Weeden was drafted onto Marv Lewis' team instead of ours they would have the same success?
Zombo
Zombo said:
5 years, 5 playoffs.
Do you think if Quinn or Weeden was drafted onto Marv Lewis' team instead of ours they would have the same success?
Zombo
Quinn yes, Weeden no.
Andy Dalton isn't transcendent talent. He's a smart, accurate QB with some balls on him surrounded by some talented players and coached by a smart coach.
I'd venture that 14-18 active QB's could do the same there.
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You don't pass on a franchise QB for a DE - just doesn't happen, Goff will be a franchise QB somewhere.
Agree... Goff's floor is franchise level... book it. I can't remember the last draft when I said that of a QB prospect. (Luck? Yes, but I thought his floor was higher than "franchise".) Draft position is all about odds and Goff rings the bell.
But even that is not enough to take him top five or even top ten. What makes him Top Two is he has upside... he is franchise-plus.
Here's his DraftBreakdown page with six-2015 games. For those who would pass on him... spend some time... see for yourselves... if you have not already.
Agree... Goff's floor is franchise level... book it. I can't remember the last draft when I said that of a QB prospect. (Luck? Yes, but I thought his floor was higher than "franchise".) Draft position is all about odds and Goff rings the bell.
But even that is not enough to take him top five or even top ten. What makes him Top Two is he has upside... he is franchise-plus.
Here's his DraftBreakdown page with six-2015 games. For those who would pass on him... spend some time... see for yourselves... if you have not already.
I wouldn't pass on him because of a lack of talent.
The only reason I would pass on him is because I believe Wentz has the same upside, with a little lower of a floor, and that we could get Wentz with our second round pick - freeing up #2 for someone else.
That's not saying I would pass on him - I just see two scenarios that are beneficial for us in this moment.
I'm awesome, and I fuck dolphins. Ghoolie 12/2/2012: I have absolutely no skills, training or pride -
Agree... Goff's floor is franchise level... book it. I can't remember the last draft when I said that of a QB prospect. (Luck? Yes, but I thought his floor was higher than "franchise".) Draft position is all about odds and Goff rings the bell.
But even that is not enough to take him top five or even top ten. What makes him Top Two is he has upside... he is franchise-plus.
Here's his DraftBreakdown page with six-2015 games. For those who would pass on him... spend some time... see for yourselves... if you have not already.
I wouldn't pass on him because of a lack of talent.
The only reason I would pass on him is because I believe Wentz has the same upside, with a little lower of a floor, and that we could get Wentz with our second round pick - freeing up #2 for someone else.
That's not saying I would pass on him - I just see two scenarios that are beneficial for us in this moment.
The only reason I would pass on him is because I believe Wentz has the same upside...
Can't argue with that as I have not looked hard at Wentz yet.
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
Agree... Goff's floor is franchise level... book it. I can't remember the last draft when I said that of a QB prospect. (Luck? Yes, but I thought his floor was higher than "franchise".) Draft position is all about odds and Goff rings the bell.
But even that is not enough to take him top five or even top ten. What makes him Top Two is he has upside... he is franchise-plus.
Here's his DraftBreakdown page with six-2015 games. For those who would pass on him... spend some time... see for yourselves... if you have not already.
I wouldn't pass on him because of a lack of talent.
The only reason I would pass on him is because I believe Wentz has the same upside, with a little lower of a floor, and that we could get Wentz with our second round pick - freeing up #2 for someone else.
That's not saying I would pass on him - I just see two scenarios that are beneficial for us in this moment.
we could get Wentz with our second round pick - freeing up #2 for someone else.
I'm not so sure. If we pass on Goff Jerry Jones might do something silly (and taking Goff), but I could see Wentz surpassing Lynch.
I could see Wentz going by #15 to the Rams, but also see him going no later than #22 to the Texans.
Would we really want to trade up to #22 to draft a quarterback?
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Andy Dalton's been there for what, 4 years, right?
Mare Lewis?
WSS
5 years, 5 playoffs.
Do you think if Quinn or Weeden was drafted onto Marv Lewis' team instead of ours they would have the same success?
Zombo
Zombo said:
5 years, 5 playoffs.
Do you think if Quinn or Weeden was drafted onto Marv Lewis' team instead of ours they would have the same success?
Zombo
Yes, Mr Z, I do. I'm not so sure about Brady Quinn, but I like the guy just because he's a Buckeye native, and he's Irish and a very distant cousin is related to me from Carroll County. But I think any quarterback drafted in the first round onto a solid team and stays there for many years has a hell of a better shot then a guy with one year of an offensive program a second year of a different one and then the shit can.
And I certainly think Brandon Weeden would have benefited from 5 years on a good team.
WSS
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Neither , Trade Manziel straight up to the Rams for Sean Mannion and draft Defense and Wide Receivers.
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The only reason I would pass on him is because I believe Wentz has the same upside...
Can't argue with that as I have not looked hard at Wentz yet.
Can't argue with that as I have not looked hard at Wentz yet.
He has flashes of brilliance, in what I've watched thus far. Goff is a more natural thrower, but the ball comes off with just as much zip as it does from Goff.
He's more of a project, but I really do like him.
I'm not so sure. If we pass on Goff Jerry Jones might do something silly (and taking Goff), but I could see Wentz surpassing Lynch.
I could see Wentz going by #15 to the Rams, but also see him going no later than #22 to the Texans.
Would we really want to trade up to #22 to draft a quarterback?
We don't have much experience moving up to #22 for a quarterback.
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your opinion of Goff is much much higher than the consensus opinion of him currently. Which is that he is probably the top qb in the class(about 25-30% of experts still like lynch better) and will be a high first round pick, but that is due more to the fact that teams always push up the top qbs because of need. Both jameis and mariota were getting higher grades than Goff or Lynch. Goff is being graded right now as being much closer to a top 5 overall pick like a blake bortles than a luck or manning.
Not saying Goff won't turn out to be very good(or very poor...I have no idea), but there is definately not some consensus out there from the experts that he is a super duper elite qb prospect.
It's January, so let's give it some time. I think the hype train will start to build as more people watch film and study his game - also after he throws at the combine and such.
I'm not sure who is, but seems like to me everybody is saying Goff is the top prospect - anybody still saying Lynch is probably out of their mind anyway.
He has very few flaws, I haven't really seen anybody saying anything significantly bad about him other than "Utah!" - which was a bad game, but it's much worse on paper than it actually looks on film.
We just need a franchise guy who can be good for many years, not necessarily a Peyton or Luck.
Bortles is OK, but I don't think he's really comparable to Goff in terms of the type of prospect he was.
It's January, so let's give it some time. I think the hype train will start to build as more people watch film and study his game - also after he throws at the combine and such.
I'm not sure who is, but seems like to me everybody is saying Goff is the top prospect - anybody still saying Lynch is probably out of their mind anyway.
He has very few flaws, I haven't really seen anybody saying anything significantly bad about him other than "Utah!" - which was a bad game, but it's much worse on paper than it actually looks on film.
We just need a franchise guy who can be good for many years, not necessarily a Peyton or Luck.
Bortles is OK, but I don't think he's really comparable to Goff in terms of the type of prospect he was.
heck until the birmingham bowl where lynch sucked, lynch was listed as 1 and goff 2 in terms of qb rankings on the espn ticker(which either tracks mcshay or kiper...cant remember which). Bortles' grade is going to be pretty similar to Goff. And of course goff is going to get a lot of hype....just as any top 10 overall qb will get leading up to the draft. So did joey harrington, mark sanchez, byron leftwich, etc.....it's not going to be as much positive hype surrounding goff comign out as jameis or mariota last year. Everything I read is saying neither qb in this years class has as much hype or is thought to be as good as those two coming out. This yeah goff will likely be the first qb off the board(and due to need at the position a very high pick no doubt which will garner some attention), but he's just not drawing the sort of raves nationally that the more famous prospects over the years have....
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It's January, so let's give it some time. I think the hype train will start to build as more people watch film and study his game - also after he throws at the combine and such.
I'm not sure who is, but seems like to me everybody is saying Goff is the top prospect - anybody still saying Lynch is probably out of their mind anyway.
He has very few flaws, I haven't really seen anybody saying anything significantly bad about him other than "Utah!" - which was a bad game, but it's much worse on paper than it actually looks on film.
We just need a franchise guy who can be good for many years, not necessarily a Peyton or Luck.
Bortles is OK, but I don't think he's really comparable to Goff in terms of the type of prospect he was.
heck until the birmingham bowl where lynch sucked, lynch was listed as 1 and goff 2 in terms of qb rankings on the espn ticker(which either tracks mcshay or kiper...cant remember which). Bortles' grade is going to be pretty similar to Goff. And of course goff is going to get a lot of hype....just as any top 10 overall qb will get leading up to the draft. So did joey harrington, mark sanchez, byron leftwich, etc.....it's not going to be as much positive hype surrounding goff comign out as jameis or mariota last year. Everything I read is saying neither qb in this years class has as much hype or is thought to be as good as those two coming out. This yeah goff will likely be the first qb off the board(and due to need at the position a very high pick no doubt which will garner some attention), but he's just not drawing the sort of raves nationally that the more famous prospects over the years have....
but he's just not drawing the sort of raves nationally that the more famous prospects over the years have....
Not exactly the best way to evaluate a prospect.
Idk about the Bortles comparison. You're comparing raves/ratings and stuff - when I look at the players Bortles and Goff are two pretty different types of quarterbacks.
Goff is a franchise QB. Won't be a journey man, won't be a bench rider. Not only that, but his ceiling is pretty damn high too.
If I'm Hue, he's my guy.
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Zombo said:
5 years, 5 playoffs.
Do you think if Quinn or Weeden was drafted onto Marv Lewis' team instead of ours they would have the same success?
Zombo
Quinn yes, Weeden no.
Andy Dalton isn't transcendent talent. He's a smart, accurate QB with some balls on him surrounded by some talented players and coached by a smart coach.
I'd venture that 14-18 active QB's could do the same there.
Quinn yes, Weeden no.
Andy Dalton isn't transcendent talent. He's a smart, accurate QB with some balls on him surrounded by some talented players and coached by a smart coach.
I'd venture that 14-18 active QB's could do the same there.
And one inactive one, apparently.
Zombo
--Brady Quinn? Really??
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Zombo said:
5 years, 5 playoffs.
Do you think if Quinn or Weeden was drafted onto Marv Lewis' team instead of ours they would have the same success?
Zombo
Yes, Mr Z, I do. I'm not so sure about Brady Quinn, but I like the guy just because he's a Buckeye native, and he's Irish and a very distant cousin is related to me from Carroll County. But I think any quarterback drafted in the first round onto a solid team and stays there for many years has a hell of a better shot then a guy with one year of an offensive program a second year of a different one and then the shit can.
And I certainly think Brandon Weeden would have benefited from 5 years on a good team.
WSS
Yes, Mr Z, I do. I'm not so sure about Brady Quinn, but I like the guy just because he's a Buckeye native, and he's Irish and a very distant cousin is related to me from Carroll County. But I think any quarterback drafted in the first round onto a solid team and stays there for many years has a hell of a better shot then a guy with one year of an offensive program a second year of a different one and then the shit can.
And I certainly think Brandon Weeden would have benefited from 5 years on a good team.
WSS
...and then applied for Social Security.
Well, let's hope Hue builds that strong team and the QB we brings in gets that patience, because if he is good enough, then we'll be that team with that guy.
Zombo
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He will probably get more patience if they overpay for him. The perception will be that he's more valuable.
WSS
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Hugh Jackson will make a deal for AJ McCarron. AJ knows the system and we're a step ahead at the gate.
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