Betsy DeVos
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So he isn't allowed to do what past administration's have done because a new precedent is set?
He can do what he is legally allowed to do, but don't complain when he is criticized for it. Many of the Republicans here criticized plenty of Obama's appointments. What's good for the goose is good for the gander. If it was wrong when Clinton did it, then it is wrong when Trump does it, too.
Very true but don't come off as shocked when someone didnt attend public school or university but got the job anyway. I don't have to even go back to the Clinton administration to find a career politician receiveing a position the he or she wasn't qualified for and I feel you know that. I encouraged posters to look it up if you feel it hasn't happened. We know that it happens at every level of government. It happens even where some of usay work.He can do what he is legally allowed to do, but don't complain when he is criticized for it. Many of the Republicans here criticized plenty of Obama's appointments. What's good for the goose is good for the gander. If it was wrong when Clinton did it, then it is wrong when Trump does it, too.
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Just read about this grizzly thing. What a completely unintelligible and frankly stocky shortsy rationale for guns in schools, which btw im not against. I dontbthink its a bad idea at all anymore for a teacher or two to be well trained and carrying. But i can sit infront of a bunch of pasty old white men and make my case without resorting to referencing the ursidae genus. I thought trump was all about smart people, but with a few exceptions the people he's putting in his cabinet seem to be legitimized idiots
"...and now...for the REST of the story.."
"...and now...for the REST of the story.."
So she's not arguing for ccw's in schools? So why talk about bears infront of a confirmation hearing?
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Sure, there is no denying that the demand for qualifications is going to come from the opposing party. That doesn't mean a demand for qualifications shouldn't come. The Education Secretary's job, however, is not retail, and that's what you are comparing it to. The qualifications that would make her better would be the management of both public and private school systems so that she could see the flaws and strengths of each and try to address them.
I guess education is closer to retail then you might want to believe.
Still I think she would be attacked if she spent her entire life as a teacher and believed charter schools should receive public financing. I think it's ideology not experience.
WSS
I guess education is closer to retail then you might want to believe.
Still I think she would be attacked if she spent her entire life as a teacher and believed charter schools should receive public financing. I think it's ideology not experience.
WSS
We run a family daycare so, limited as that might be, so I have some idea of how much of it is 'retail' and how much of it is not. You may be right, she might be criticized for her ideology, but if she arrived at that ideology after having experienced the gamut of schooling options, I personally would be convinced as to her qualifications.
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Very true but don't come off as shocked when someone didnt attend public school or university but got the job anyway. I don't have to even go back to the Clinton administration to find a career politician receiveing a position the he or she wasn't qualified for and I feel you know that. I encouraged posters to look it up if you feel it hasn't happened. We know that it happens at every level of government. It happens even where some of usay work.He can do what he is legally allowed to do, but don't complain when he is criticized for it. Many of the Republicans here criticized plenty of Obama's appointments. What's good for the goose is good for the gander. If it was wrong when Clinton did it, then it is wrong when Trump does it, too.
Very true but don't come off as shocked when someone didnt attend public school or university but got the job anyway. I don't have to even go back to the Clinton administration to find a career politician receiveing a position the he or she wasn't qualified for and I feel you know that. I encouraged posters to look it up if you feel it hasn't happened. We know that it happens at every level of government. It happens even where some of usay work.
The fact that she went through private schooling her whole life is a non-issue to me, as is her advocacy for charter schools, which I'm not against either. The issue is what she's done since then does not qualify her to be Secretary of Education. She's never run a loan program, never run a bank, never administered a school. Surely Trump can come up with a better candidate who also is open to Charter Schools.
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Yes indeed. I'm so mad I could melt a snowflake.
...can't tell if that's an attempt at a joke or you're making a pass at me?
Feels like the latter. No, thanks.
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I guess education is closer to retail then you might want to believe.
Still I think she would be attacked if she spent her entire life as a teacher and believed charter schools should receive public financing. I think it's ideology not experience.
WSS
We run a family daycare so, limited as that might be, so I have some idea of how much of it is 'retail' and how much of it is not. You may be right, she might be criticized for her ideology, but if she arrived at that ideology after having experienced the gamut of schooling options, I personally would be convinced as to her qualifications.
I'm sure it's possible that you would. Of course I think you may be in a small minority of Democrat voters. If in fact you voted for Hillary or oppose Trump.We run a family daycare so, limited as that might be, so I have some idea of how much of it is 'retail' and how much of it is not. You may be right, she might be criticized for her ideology, but if she arrived at that ideology after having experienced the gamut of schooling options, I personally would be convinced as to her qualifications.
Just an aside i minored in secondary education. And Cal's wife is a lifelong school teacher I believe right?
Case in point the biggest story from her nomination has been the grizzly bears.
WSS
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Who did I attack? Re read what I posted.
So basically neither of you can defend the selection of DeVos with anything substantial, so you resort to attacking others. Giving money to causes makes her an expert now? Right, I've donated to cancer research, so that must make me an expert at cancer research!
The 'attack' term was meant more for Cal, but you did criticize Clinton's pick from 20 years ago, which is fine, but irrelevant. It's basically arguing that the precedent makes it okay to appoint someone with no experience. I thought Trump was supposed to be the outsider who was going to do things differently in Washington? So how is appointing someone with zero qualifications different than doing something you claim has been happening in Washington for decades?
The 'attack' term was meant more for Cal, but you did criticize Clinton's pick from 20 years ago, which is fine, but irrelevant. It's basically arguing that the precedent makes it okay to appoint someone with no experience. I thought Trump was supposed to be the outsider who was going to do things differently in Washington? So how is appointing someone with zero qualifications different than doing something you claim has been happening in Washington for decades?
You claim it hasn't been happening. Which is it? Apparently Obama's nominees were eminently qualified and yet what did we get? Common core and sliding American academic performance that should be a national shame.
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The 'attack' term was meant more for Cal, but you did criticize Clinton's pick from 20 years ago, which is fine, but irrelevant. It's basically arguing that the precedent makes it okay to appoint someone with no experience. I thought Trump was supposed to be the outsider who was going to do things differently in Washington? So how is appointing someone with zero qualifications different than doing something you claim has been happening in Washington for decades?
You claim it hasn't been happening. Which is it? Apparently Obama's nominees were eminently qualified and yet what did we get? Common core and sliding American academic performance that should be a national shame.
You claim it hasn't been happening. Which is it? Apparently Obama's nominees were eminently qualified and yet what did we get? Common core and sliding American academic performance that should be a national shame.
You're kind of jumping into a convo with Erie mid-stream. I didn't claim it wasn't happening. I am claiming that the fact that it happened in the past doesn't mean it is the right thing to continue doing.
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And Cal's wife is a lifelong school teacher I believe right? Steve
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Yes. She is retired, too, now. We are having a blast. She was always very
conservative, obviously kept her politics to herself. The one time the union
rep smarted off to her because she couldn't get her to commit to voting for
obamao.... all her friends teachers went to the union rep and told her to STFU,
and never pull that again. My Wife simply smiled and told her to mind her own business,
and walked away. Her fellow teachers got involved, and made sure I knew they did. lol
I would have made a visit to the school....
You know, a lawyer who goes to a friend's church, led the way to building a wheelchair ramp
for someone in their church who is now disabled. He didn't have to be a professional ramp builder.
My Wife and I built a ramp for a friend, we never did it before. But it turned out outstanding.
Of course, she's so brilliant she designed it in her head, and I cut up the cutouts, and she drilled the
holes... no blueprint. We built one before. It was excellent, per the friend's Mom and her brother,
who is disabled. Were we "qualified" ? sure. We could do it. Should a sunday school teacher not
be one because she never taught before? come on.
It's pretty apparent that one who is ingrained in the status quo, doesn't fix it. That is why previous politicians
didn't fix it. That is why it's outstanding that Trump worked in private sector - he won't be ingrained
in the status quo. That is how you get things looked at objectively, with no bias.
Obamao's two sec of ed nominees were very heavily ingrained in the public education status quo.
They went along for the ride, didn't fix diddley squat, and their bragging rights common core was
as much a political bragging/reality sucking bunch of crap as was obamaocare.
Made things worse, but it was part of their "legacy".
That's why they refused to allow reps to have any part in the solution.
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Yes I read it that's why I posted it. Many of the pros and cons of her nomination are listed and excused or debunked.Did you read that Snopes article? Or did you pull a Cal?
What did I say that was wrong?
I'm not picking a fight with you here just wondering as I assume you are.
WSS
Yes I read it that's why I posted it. Many of the pros and cons of her nomination are listed and excused or debunked.
I'm not picking a fight with you here just wondering as I assume you are.
WSS
You posted in a clearly condescending tone that I was getting my information from memes. You then provided a link to Snopes, as if to debunk something. You've yet to tell me what I've said that was incorrect
Are you gonna try to moonwalk all of the way out of this?
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So.... Has anyone actually said why she's a good pick yet?
I'm just reading a bunch of "Well Clinton picked unqualified people too!"
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Yes I read it that's why I posted it. Many of the pros and cons of her nomination are listed and excused or debunked.
I'm not picking a fight with you here just wondering as I assume you are.
WSS
You posted in a clearly condescending tone that I was getting my information from memes. You then provided a link to Snopes, as if to debunk something. You've yet to tell me what I've said that was incorrect
Are you gonna try to moonwalk all of the way out of this?
If you thought I posted that in any type of condescending intent you are mistaken, even though your post which was obviously an attack certainly deserves it.You posted in a clearly condescending tone that I was getting my information from memes. You then provided a link to Snopes, as if to debunk something. You've yet to tell me what I've said that was incorrect
Are you gonna try to moonwalk all of the way out of this?
I haven't said a harsh word to anyone on the subject.
WSS
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If you thought I posted that in any type of condescending intent you are mistaken, even though your post which was obviously an attack certainly deserves it.You posted in a clearly condescending tone that I was getting my information from memes. You then provided a link to Snopes, as if to debunk something. You've yet to tell me what I've said that was incorrect
Are you gonna try to moonwalk all of the way out of this?
I haven't said a harsh word to anyone on the subject.
WSS
If you thought I posted that in any type of condescending intent you are mistaken, even though your post which was obviously an attack certainly deserves it.
I haven't said a harsh word to anyone on the subject.
WSS
An attack? What? Tell me which of my first posts was an "attack".
You've officially gone from backtracking on your first post to turning the whole situation on me. Just face it, you tried to get on me for "getting my info from memes", and you posted a Snopes article insinuating what I said was false. Except nothing I said was false. And now you realize that, and you're trying to backtrack.
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If you thought I posted that in any type of condescending intent you are mistaken, even though your post which was obviously an attack certainly deserves it.
I haven't said a harsh word to anyone on the subject.
WSS
An attack? What? Tell me which of my first posts was an "attack".
You've officially gone from backtracking on your first post to turning the whole situation on me. Just face it, you tried to get on me for "getting my info from memes", and you posted a Snopes article insinuating what I said was false. Except nothing I said was false. And now you realize that, and you're trying to backtrack.
An attack? What? Tell me which of my first posts was an "attack".
You've officially gone from backtracking on your first post to turning the whole situation on me. Just face it, you tried to get on me for "getting my info from memes", and you posted a Snopes article insinuating what I said was false. Except nothing I said was false. And now you realize that, and you're trying to backtrack.
Posted the Snopes article, you miserable whining jackass, just because it laid out some of the complaints from the left and whether they believe that those were valid complaints or not. That was the sole basis for the Snopes article. Take it for what it's worth or sticking up your ass.
Your little post wondering why anyone would think she was qualifying citing no Public School experience no worrying about student loans and something something grizzly bears...
Not solD on her one way or the other but not being a teachers union hack is 1 plus in my opinion.
WSS
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You said I got my info from memes...
... And posted a Snopes article...
... Alright, fuck it Steve. You didn't do the thing you clearly did.
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The OUTRAGE of the snowflakes!
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So.... Has anyone actually said why she's a good pick yet?
I'm just reading a bunch of "Well Clinton picked unqualified people too!"
So.... Has anyone actually said why she's a good pick yet?
I'm just reading a bunch of "Well Clinton picked unqualified people too!"
There's not any reason why she's a good pick. People can be good at things they're not supposedly qualified for. Steve Jobs was not a tech guy. He was not an engineer and he was a douche yet he built the single most towering technology company in the country. That's not comparing Betsy DeVos to Steve Jobs, since you've shown the innate inability to not see the forest for the trees in the past, but only to point out that all the education and qualifications in the world can't make somebody good at a job. Only being good at the job can do that.
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So.... Has anyone actually said why she's a good pick yet?
I'm just reading a bunch of "Well Clinton picked unqualified people too!"
There's not any reason why she's a good pick. People can be good at things they're not supposedly qualified for. Steve Jobs was not a tech guy. He was not an engineer and he was a douche yet he built the single most towering technology company in the country. That's not comparing Betsy DeVos to Steve Jobs, since you've shown the innate inability to not see the forest for the trees in the past, but only to point out that all the education and qualifications in the world can't make somebody good at a job. Only being good at the job can do that.
since you've shown the innate inability to not see the forest for the trees in the past
when?
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It's really hard to choose, but Devos' combination of a lack of experience and purely ideological driven agenda puts her near the bottom of pile/ top of the list of objectionable cabinet nominees.
We do not have to judge her in a vacuum. She has a track record in Michigan.
Betsy DeVos and the twilight of public education
In Detroit, parents of school-age children have plenty of choices, thanks to the nation's largest urban network of charter schools.
What remains in short supply is quality.
In Brightmoor, the only high school left is Detroit Community Schools, a charter boasting more than a decade of abysmal test scores and, until recently, a superintendent who earned $130,000 a year despite a dearth of educational experience or credentials.
On the west side, another charter school, Hope Academy, has been serving the community around Grand River and Livernois for 20 years. Its test scores have been among the lowest in the state throughout those two decades; in 2013 the school ranked in the first percentile, the absolute bottom for academic performance. Two years later, its charter was renewed.
Or if you live downtown, you could try Woodward Academy, a charter that has limped along near the bottom of school achievement since 1998, while its operator has been allowed to expand into other communities.
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Of course it's only the angle of the ideology that bothers the Democrats. Not that she's an idealogue.
WSS
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