Indians To Stop Using Chief Wahoo Logo In Their Uniforms in 2019
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To piss your generation off?
Cool ?Â
Cool ?Â
Hey we geezers are cool about it.....
......and keep off my lawn dammit!
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I was using we're as a general term since I'm American. You clearly have no problem with PC culture winning out, so please don't lie to us and say you do.
The notion that Chief Wahoo is racist is equally as dumb as your Wal-Mart example (in fact it's more dumb since Walmart might actually broach up against civil rights laws [don't know or particularly care]).
This is anecdotal but I follow about 5 Indians pages on facebook. Not a single comment or reaction to this that I've seen is positive. Literally hundreds of comments I've seen are all negative. So yeah, your argument about the fans is wrong. And if you polled MLB fans generally, I bet they'd be pro-Wahoo too. So which fans are you talking about?Â
Wrong. I have always told my friends that it was the best logo in sports. Nice try though.
Youâre making so many assumptions.Â
No, tradition isnât a good enough reason. Change is inevitable, accept it or live in a miserable existence.
My Wal-Mart example isnât dumb, itâs 100% on point.Â
Walmart has a reason to need to lock up the black hair care products.
What reason do the Indians have to need to keep Chief Wahoo?
Youâre making so many assumptions.Â
No, tradition isnât a good enough reason. Change is inevitable, accept it or live in a miserable existence.
My Wal-Mart example isnât dumb, itâs 100% on point.Â
Walmart has a reason to need to lock up the black hair care products.
What reason do the Indians have to need to keep Chief Wahoo?
You're backtracking. You said the fans, who are the customers, didn't like it, and since it's a business, they catered to those fans. When I pointed out that virtually no fans are in support of this move (it's a small minority, no pun intended), you're now claiming they don't "need" to keep the Chief. So I guess you realize the whole fans don't want it thing was bunk?
In 2019 the fans can still buy and display what they want -but- if they buy or are given promotional shirts and jerseys they will not have the chief wahoo anywhere on them. Should be interesting to see how much it really matters.
Human nature being what it is I imagine there will be a LOT of Wahoo in the stands, on cars and houses, we always had a Wahoo in our upstairs window.
I imagine sales of everything should be quite brisk everywhere including the counterfeit and nonlicensed merchandise.Â
Ahhhhhh the business of sporrs.
Wahoo on the upstairs window. That's a sweet idea.
A guy on my street here in Austin has it on his curb numbers. Also has a big Brownie and other Browns stickets in his garage. Pretty cool.
The way I see it....the guys who don't want it gone don't really give a rat's arse about the logo itself. Â They are just upset that perhaps political correctness has taken hold to extinguish a racial stereotype.Â
Which means either: Â A. they like that it is racially insensitive...or B. Â they don't care if it is or isn't....they just want to maintain it so that "PC culture" or some nonsense does not prevail.
Hardly anyone here has lived as long as I have with Chief Wahoo...and I have and do own numeous articles of paraphenalia with that logo on it...including hats, shirts, jackets etc. Â No one here practically has had as long a term attachment to it. Â Â
But, it is not that big of a deal to me if it is gone. Â It is...when it comes down to it....just a marketing gimmick. Â And marketing gimmicks come and go...and if this one goes...so be it. Â Just tell me what the next one is.
Wrong. I have always told my friends that it was the best logo in sports. Nice try though.
No, I am absolutely right.....be cause it is a matter of opinion and my opinion carries far more weight.   How long have you been an Indians fan?  I started being one around 1962. And as much as I have cared for it....I never thought by any means that it was the best logo in sports. To me the best logo was always the no logo of the Browns. As I said, it was always just a marketing device. If I can live with a change in whatever marketing device they use after 55 years, so can you.  Besides....as I noted...they are NOT giving it up as a marketing device...they are just not going to put it on their uniforms.
I mean...take the Browns......as noted...they have NO logo on their uniforms....but they certainly have logos.....the Brownie, the dog logos, Â the B logos etc. Â They are not on the uniforms, yet they are heavily marketed. That will likely be the case for Chief Wahoo.
So your argument for why I don't actually care about the logo is that you don't actually like the logo?Â
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Identity Politics and Cultural Appropriation are the cause of this. The neo-marxist thought of thinking taught at universities preys on people me and war's age (20s) and younger. People are taught to think that everything is a hierarchy of power with white males at the top and that it's all their fault. They are also taught that if they're offended, they can change the way people think, talk, or act. One example is Dr. Jordan Peterson in Canada and the recent law making everyone call people by their preferred gender pro-nouns, such as Zi and Zir. One you enforce people saying certain words, you're on the fine line from limiting free speech.
On the Wahoo subject, most people don't know that we used to be the Cleveland Naps, after legend Nap Lajoie. Most people also didn't know that Jim Thorpe had an all indian football team with an indian name and logo, and that the Indians named the team after Louis Sockalexis, a Native American star, that played in Cleveland.[17]
The fact is that people consider that "Native Americans were oppressed", which is true, BUT that has nothing to do with the fact that the team was very likely named after the star.
I'm not a big fan of the Chief Wahoo Logo, but I think because people don't like something or are "offended", that doesn't give them the right to tell you what to do. That's ridiculous.
Dolan is on record saying he didn't think it was offensive, but to make a deal to have the ALL STAR GAME in Cleveland, I think he gave into "phasing the chief out".
But the question is whats next? Why doesn't Kansas City get rid of the Chiefs? Atlanta rename the Braves? Washington get rid of the Redskins, and Chicago do away with the Blackhawks. Truly, all of those teams must be racist, and whatever someone else's perception of something must be more important then what the business owner, fans who pay money, or other consensus citizens think.
Also, we should do away with Columbus Day, and turn it into Indigenous People's day like they did here in Cali. Even though most Italians in New York didn't celebrate Columbus himself, but the fact that Italian Americans accomplished a lot of good in America and did a lot of good (The friction was even shown in a Sopranos Episode).
We should tear down every Robert E Lee statue, and any statue of any person that "offended" anyone, even though Statues are a reminder of history, not a celebration of that specific person.
Maybe if we don't remember the evils of history and the past, it might repeat itself? But the fact is people should have the freedom to be stupid, and to have a stupid opinion.Â
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Youâre making so many assumptions.Â
No, tradition isnât a good enough reason. Change is inevitable, accept it or live in a miserable existence.
My Wal-Mart example isnât dumb, itâs 100% on point.Â
Walmart has a reason to need to lock up the black hair care products.
What reason do the Indians have to need to keep Chief Wahoo?
You're backtracking. You said the fans, who are the customers, didn't like it, and since it's a business, they catered to those fans. When I pointed out that virtually no fans are in support of this move (it's a small minority, no pun intended), you're now claiming they don't "need" to keep the Chief. So I guess you realize the whole fans don't want it thing was bunk?
In 2019 the fans can still buy and display what they want -but- if they buy or are given promotional shirts and jerseys they will not have the chief wahoo anywhere on them. Should be interesting to see how much it really matters.
Human nature being what it is I imagine there will be a LOT of Wahoo in the stands, on cars and houses, we always had a Wahoo in our upstairs window.
I imagine sales of everything should be quite brisk everywhere including the counterfeit and nonlicensed merchandise.Â
Ahhhhhh the business of sporrs.
Wahoo on the upstairs window. That's a sweet idea.
A guy on my street here in Austin has it on his curb numbers. Also has a big Brownie and other Browns stickets in his garage. Pretty cool.
The way I see it....the guys who don't want it gone don't really give a rat's arse about the logo itself. Â They are just upset that perhaps political correctness has taken hold to extinguish a racial stereotype.Â
Which means either: Â A. they like that it is racially insensitive...or B. Â they don't care if it is or isn't....they just want to maintain it so that "PC culture" or some nonsense does not prevail.
Hardly anyone here has lived as long as I have with Chief Wahoo...and I have and do own numeous articles of paraphenalia with that logo on it...including hats, shirts, jackets etc. Â No one here practically has had as long a term attachment to it. Â Â
But, it is not that big of a deal to me if it is gone. Â It is...when it comes down to it....just a marketing gimmick. Â And marketing gimmicks come and go...and if this one goes...so be it. Â Just tell me what the next one is.
Wrong. I have always told my friends that it was the best logo in sports. Nice try though.
No, I am absolutely right.....be cause it is a matter of opinion and my opinion carries far more weight.   How long have you been an Indians fan?  I started being one around 1962. And as much as I have cared for it....I never thought by any means that it was the best logo in sports. To me the best logo was always the no logo of the Browns. As I said, it was always just a marketing device. If I can live with a change in whatever marketing device they use after 55 years, so can you.  Besides....as I noted...they are NOT giving it up as a marketing device...they are just not going to put it on their uniforms.
I mean...take the Browns......as noted...they have NO logo on their uniforms....but they certainly have logos.....the Brownie, the dog logos, Â the B logos etc. Â They are not on the uniforms, yet they are heavily marketed. That will likely be the case for Chief Wahoo.
So your argument for why I don't actually care about the logo is that you don't actually like the logo?Â
You're backtracking. You said the fans, who are the customers, didn't like it, and since it's a business, they catered to those fans. When I pointed out that virtually no fans are in support of this move (it's a small minority, no pun intended), you're now claiming they don't "need" to keep the Chief. So I guess you realize the whole fans don't want it thing was bunk?
Wahoo on the upstairs window. That's a sweet idea.
A guy on my street here in Austin has it on his curb numbers. Also has a big Brownie and other Browns stickets in his garage. Pretty cool.
So your argument for why I don't actually care about the logo is that you don't actually like the logo?Â
I donât believe I ever said the majority of people donât like it. Iâm saying that the people who own the rights to âChief Wahooâ decided that they want to get rid of it. They obviously thought there was enough opposition and that it was a good business move.Â
Now if the government came in and MADE them change it, THAT would be where I have a problem. But that isnât the case.
Whether I personally have a problem with Chief Wahoo or not is irrelevant.Â
Its ironic that you and many on this board who love small government and personal freedoms just like me, want to FORCE an organization to KEEP something against their will.
Sounds a bit hypocritical.
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Identity Politics and Cultural Appropriation are the cause of this. The neo-marxist thought of thinking taught at universities preys on people me and war's age (20s) and younger. People are taught to think that everything is a hierarchy of power with white males at the top and that it's all their fault. They are also taught that if they're offended, they can change the way people think, talk, or act. One example is Dr. Jordan Peterson in Canada and the recent law making everyone call people by their preferred gender pro-nouns, such as Zi and Zir. One you enforce people saying certain words, you're on the fine line from limiting free speech.
On the Wahoo subject, most people don't know that we used to be the Cleveland Naps, after legend Nap Lajoie. Most people also didn't know that Jim Thorpe had an all indian football team with an indian name and logo, and that the Indians named the team after Louis Sockalexis, a Native American star, that played in Cleveland.[17]
The fact is that people consider that "Native Americans were oppressed", which is true, BUT that has nothing to do with the fact that the team was very likely named after the star.
I'm not a big fan of the Chief Wahoo Logo, but I think because people don't like something or are "offended", that doesn't give them the right to tell you what to do. That's ridiculous.
Dolan is on record saying he didn't think it was offensive, but to make a deal to have the ALL STAR GAME in Cleveland, I think he gave into "phasing the chief out".
But the question is whats next? Why doesn't Kansas City get rid of the Chiefs? Atlanta rename the Braves? Washington get rid of the Redskins, and Chicago do away with the Blackhawks. Truly, all of those teams must be racist, and whatever someone else's perception of something must be more important then what the business owner, fans who pay money, or other consensus citizens think.
Also, we should do away with Columbus Day, and turn it into Indigenous People's day like they did here in Cali. Even though most Italians in New York didn't celebrate Columbus himself, but the fact that Italian Americans accomplished a lot of good in America and did a lot of good (The friction was even shown in a Sopranos Episode).
We should tear down every Robert E Lee statue, and any statue of any person that "offended" anyone, even though Statues are a reminder of history, not a celebration of that specific person.
Maybe if we don't remember the evils of history and the past, it might repeat itself? But the fact is people should have the freedom to be stupid, and to have a stupid opinion.Â
Identity Politics and Cultural Appropriation are the cause of this. The neo-marxist thought of thinking taught at universities preys on people me and war's age (20s) and younger. People are taught to think that everything is a hierarchy of power with white males at the top and that it's all their fault. They are also taught that if they're offended, they can change the way people think, talk, or act. One example is Dr. Jordan Peterson in Canada and the recent law making everyone call people by their preferred gender pro-nouns, such as Zi and Zir. One you enforce people saying certain words, you're on the fine line from limiting free speech.
On the Wahoo subject, most people don't know that we used to be the Cleveland Naps, after legend Nap Lajoie. Most people also didn't know that Jim Thorpe had an all indian football team with an indian name and logo, and that the Indians named the team after Louis Sockalexis, a Native American star, that played in Cleveland.[17]
The fact is that people consider that "Native Americans were oppressed", which is true, BUT that has nothing to do with the fact that the team was very likely named after the star.
I'm not a big fan of the Chief Wahoo Logo, but I think because people don't like something or are "offended", that doesn't give them the right to tell you what to do. That's ridiculous.
Dolan is on record saying he didn't think it was offensive, but to make a deal to have the ALL STAR GAME in Cleveland, I think he gave into "phasing the chief out".
But the question is whats next? Why doesn't Kansas City get rid of the Chiefs? Atlanta rename the Braves? Washington get rid of the Redskins, and Chicago do away with the Blackhawks. Truly, all of those teams must be racist, and whatever someone else's perception of something must be more important then what the business owner, fans who pay money, or other consensus citizens think.
Also, we should do away with Columbus Day, and turn it into Indigenous People's day like they did here in Cali. Even though most Italians in New York didn't celebrate Columbus himself, but the fact that Italian Americans accomplished a lot of good in America and did a lot of good (The friction was even shown in a Sopranos Episode).
We should tear down every Robert E Lee statue, and any statue of any person that "offended" anyone, even though Statues are a reminder of history, not a celebration of that specific person.
Maybe if we don't remember the evils of history and the past, it might repeat itself? But the fact is people should have the freedom to be stupid, and to have a stupid opinion.Â
I absolutely agree with everything you say, except for the origins of Chief Wahoo.
The claim that Chief Wahoo and the Indians were named to âhonorâ Louis Sockalexis have been debunked man. Plus, the guy was a raging alcoholic who only played 94 games. On top of that, Sockalexisâ descendants donât like it either. So weâre âhonoringâ a guy whoâs family wants Chief Wahoo and the Indians name gone. Yeah, we sure honor and respect him.
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Don't say you believe we are way too PC and support this. Here's a logical argument: he's been the Indians logo since 1928 and the fans love him.Â
Now, without making a PC and yes, quite millennial, argument, tell us why it should be done.Â
It should be done because the Cleveland Indians organization wanted it to be done. It wasnât the government telling them what to do, it was a business decision made by the owners. End of discussion.
Clearly not all fans loved it. If all fans loved it, it wouldâve stayed. The owners deemed it more profitable to get rid of it, because there were enough fans that didnât like it. Simple business decision. Thatâs how you run a business that stays afloat.
I don't need to give you Sheet. Pocohantas.
Because you donât have a logical response. Youâre playing identity politics. Itâs ok to admit that.
It should be done because the Cleveland Indians organization wanted it to be done. It wasnât the government telling them what to do, it was a business decision made by the owners. End of discussion.
Clearly not all fans loved it. If all fans loved it, it wouldâve stayed. The owners deemed it more profitable to get rid of it, because there were enough fans that didnât like it. Simple business decision. Thatâs how you run a business that stays afloat.
Because you donât have a logical response. Youâre playing identity politics. Itâs ok to admit that.
Dude, WTF are you smoking. Wahoo is not neimg pulled down because of lack of interest. You out of touch pimpledick. Wahoo is beong pulled because the owner is a liberal and  caved to PC.
The Cleveland Browns have the hardest hit players in the NFL -
It should be done because the Cleveland Indians organization wanted it to be done. It wasnât the government telling them what to do, it was a business decision made by the owners. End of discussion.
Clearly not all fans loved it. If all fans loved it, it wouldâve stayed. The owners deemed it more profitable to get rid of it, because there were enough fans that didnât like it. Simple business decision. Thatâs how you run a business that stays afloat.
Because you donât have a logical response. Youâre playing identity politics. Itâs ok to admit that.
Dude, WTF are you smoking. Wahoo is not neimg pulled down because of lack of interest. You out of touch pimpledick. Wahoo is beong pulled because the owner is a liberal and  caved to PC.
Dude, WTF are you smoking. Wahoo is not neimg pulled down because of lack of interest. You out of touch pimpledick. Wahoo is beong pulled because the owner is a liberal and  caved to PC.
Wrong, it's MLB and not just Cleveland, it's not just the part owner, try reading sometime. Liberal or conservative has nothing to do with it.Â
Chief Wahoo, the grinning, red-faced caricature of a Native American that has served as the Cleveland Indiansâ logo for more than 70 years, will be phased out at the end of the 2018 baseball season, a long-expected but politically fraught move that places pressure on the handful of remaining sports franchises that still use Native American imagery and nicknames, most notably the NFLâs Washington Redskins.
The Indiansâ change, announced Monday in a statement from Major League Baseball, came at the urging of Commissioner Rob Manfred, who began pressing Indians chief executive and part-owner Paul Dolan nearly a year ago to eliminate Chief Wahoo, the presence of which had become a flashpoint between many fans of the team and advocacy groups that considered it to be racist.
âMajor League Baseball is committed to building a culture of diversity and inclusion throughout the game,â Manfred said in his statement. Dolan, he said, âmade clear there are fans who have a longstanding attachment to the logo and its place in the history of the team. Nonetheless, the club ultimately agreed with my position that the logo is no longer appropriate for on-field use.â..........CONTINUED IN LINK........
..........While the team will stop using the insignia on its uniforms and signage beginning in 2019, it will retain the trademark for Chief Wahoo and will continue to sell merchandise with the logo in the Cleveland market and a limited number of international markets, at least in part to satisfy a requirement for keeping ownership of the trademark. If those rights were relinquished, outside entities could profit off the logo........CONTINUED IN LINK.........
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It should be done because the Cleveland Indians organization wanted it to be done. It wasnât the government telling them what to do, it was a business decision made by the owners. End of discussion.
Clearly not all fans loved it. If all fans loved it, it wouldâve stayed. The owners deemed it more profitable to get rid of it, because there were enough fans that didnât like it. Simple business decision. Thatâs how you run a business that stays afloat.
Because you donât have a logical response. Youâre playing identity politics. Itâs ok to admit that.
Dude, WTF are you smoking. Wahoo is not neimg pulled down because of lack of interest. You out of touch pimpledick. Wahoo is beong pulled because the owner is a liberal and  caved to PC.
Dude, WTF are you smoking. Wahoo is not neimg pulled down because of lack of interest. You out of touch pimpledick. Wahoo is beong pulled because the owner is a liberal and  caved to PC.
Iâm out of touch? Dude, Iâm a member of the generation that will be taking over America in the next 10 years. I can tell you for a FACT, 90% of young adults, liberal or conservative, donât care if they get rid of Chief Wahoo. Smart businessmen always spot trends AHEAD of time, and they see this. They donât give a PHUCK about your old, outdated, flaccid pimpledick opinion.
As for the business side, it is a GREAT business move, an absolute win-win. Get rid of the controversy surrounding the logo. That increases the value of Chief Wahoo, which will still be sold as merchandise.
But yeah, Iâm out of touch.
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That's what the hippies said when they were going to take over back in the 60's!
"You planning on having a long relationship with that glass or are you going to drink it? Drink up, man. Maybe we can get another.â - Janis Joplin, 1970. -
Youâre making so many assumptions.Â
No, tradition isnât a good enough reason. Change is inevitable, accept it or live in a miserable existence.
My Wal-Mart example isnât dumb, itâs 100% on point.Â
Walmart has a reason to need to lock up the black hair care products.
What reason do the Indians have to need to keep Chief Wahoo?
You're backtracking. You said the fans, who are the customers, didn't like it, and since it's a business, they catered to those fans. When I pointed out that virtually no fans are in support of this move (it's a small minority, no pun intended), you're now claiming they don't "need" to keep the Chief. So I guess you realize the whole fans don't want it thing was bunk?
In 2019 the fans can still buy and display what they want -but- if they buy or are given promotional shirts and jerseys they will not have the chief wahoo anywhere on them. Should be interesting to see how much it really matters.
Human nature being what it is I imagine there will be a LOT of Wahoo in the stands, on cars and houses, we always had a Wahoo in our upstairs window.
I imagine sales of everything should be quite brisk everywhere including the counterfeit and nonlicensed merchandise.Â
Ahhhhhh the business of sporrs.
Wahoo on the upstairs window. That's a sweet idea.
A guy on my street here in Austin has it on his curb numbers. Also has a big Brownie and other Browns stickets in his garage. Pretty cool.
The way I see it....the guys who don't want it gone don't really give a rat's arse about the logo itself. Â They are just upset that perhaps political correctness has taken hold to extinguish a racial stereotype.Â
Which means either: Â A. they like that it is racially insensitive...or B. Â they don't care if it is or isn't....they just want to maintain it so that "PC culture" or some nonsense does not prevail.
Hardly anyone here has lived as long as I have with Chief Wahoo...and I have and do own numeous articles of paraphenalia with that logo on it...including hats, shirts, jackets etc. Â No one here practically has had as long a term attachment to it. Â Â
But, it is not that big of a deal to me if it is gone. Â It is...when it comes down to it....just a marketing gimmick. Â And marketing gimmicks come and go...and if this one goes...so be it. Â Just tell me what the next one is.
Wrong. I have always told my friends that it was the best logo in sports. Nice try though.
No, I am absolutely right.....be cause it is a matter of opinion and my opinion carries far more weight.   How long have you been an Indians fan?  I started being one around 1962. And as much as I have cared for it....I never thought by any means that it was the best logo in sports. To me the best logo was always the no logo of the Browns. As I said, it was always just a marketing device. If I can live with a change in whatever marketing device they use after 55 years, so can you.  Besides....as I noted...they are NOT giving it up as a marketing device...they are just not going to put it on their uniforms.
I mean...take the Browns......as noted...they have NO logo on their uniforms....but they certainly have logos.....the Brownie, the dog logos, Â the B logos etc. Â They are not on the uniforms, yet they are heavily marketed. That will likely be the case for Chief Wahoo.
So your argument for why I don't actually care about the logo is that you don't actually like the logo?Â
Y
So your argument for why I don't actually care about the logo is that you don't actually like the logo?Â
No. Â Where did you ever read that I don't like the logo? Â Â Like I said...I have lived with it my whole life. Â And I have it all over Tribe gear that I own. Â
What I said is : Â A. It was inevitable that it should go away and B. Â that it is a marketing gimmick.....just like all other team logos....and if it goes away...it is no hair off my arse because whatever they come up with next will probably be fine.Â
C. Â What I said was that those complaining about the removal of the logo do not really care about that logo so much.....they just want to complain about some perceived political correctness being involved in its removal.Â
My position is: Â I like the Chief....I have lived my life with it. Â But I understand that it is a racial caricature...and that it can be offensive to some. Â So, if the team decide's it is in their best interest to no longer use it on their uniforms or on the walls of the stadium.....I am fine with that. Â They are still not giving it up. Â They will still sell trinkets to people with the logo on it. Â And that is fine as well.
Now....do you understand the words that are  coming out of my mouth?  Or do I have to reiterate it for the 4th or 5th time?
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That's what the hippies said when they were going to take over back in the 60's!
That's what the hippies said when they were going to take over back in the 60's!
Yawn. Iâm still waiting for you to add anything intelligent or relevant to the conversation.
Cant wait for your response to be âyou tooâ
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I'm having fun with you. Do you need a safe space or time out?
"You planning on having a long relationship with that glass or are you going to drink it? Drink up, man. Maybe we can get another.â - Janis Joplin, 1970. -
That's what the hippies said when they were going to take over back in the 60's!
That's what the hippies said when they were going to take over back in the 60's!
They did take over. Â What else can explain why a lot of them voted for Trump other than drug addled idiocy?
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I'm having fun with you. Do you need a safe space or time out?
I'm having fun with you. Do you need a safe space or time out?
If your idea of fun is unsuccessfully trying to piss off someone on a Browns forum, then I actually feel bad for you and Iâll be nice to you.
No, I donât need a safe space lol. I actually enjoy debating people with opposing views, itâs the only way to come to the truth. I was really hoping to have a discussion with you, but itâs clear youâd rather act like a child instead. Which is fine, but maybe you should take a time out
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Poor child.
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I'm having fun with you. Do you need a safe space or time out?
If your idea of fun is unsuccessfully trying to piss off someone on a Browns forum, then I actually feel bad for you and Iâll be nice to you.
No, I donât need a safe space lol. I actually enjoy debating people with opposing views, itâs the only way to come to the truth. I was really hoping to have a discussion with you, but itâs clear youâd rather act like a child instead. Which is fine, but maybe you should take a time out
If your idea of fun is unsuccessfully trying to piss off someone on a Browns forum, then I actually feel bad for you and Iâll be nice to you.
No, I donât need a safe space lol. I actually enjoy debating people with opposing views, itâs the only way to come to the truth. I was really hoping to have a discussion with you, but itâs clear youâd rather act like a child instead. Which is fine, but maybe you should take a time out
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Identity Politics and Cultural Appropriation are the cause of this. The neo-marxist thought of thinking taught at universities preys on people me and war's age (20s) and younger. People are taught to think that everything is a hierarchy of power with white males at the top and that it's all their fault. They are also taught that if they're offended, they can change the way people think, talk, or act. One example is Dr. Jordan Peterson in Canada and the recent law making everyone call people by their preferred gender pro-nouns, such as Zi and Zir. One you enforce people saying certain words, you're on the fine line from limiting free speech.
On the Wahoo subject, most people don't know that we used to be the Cleveland Naps, after legend Nap Lajoie. Most people also didn't know that Jim Thorpe had an all indian football team with an indian name and logo, and that the Indians named the team after Louis Sockalexis, a Native American star, that played in Cleveland.[17]
The fact is that people consider that "Native Americans were oppressed", which is true, BUT that has nothing to do with the fact that the team was very likely named after the star.
I'm not a big fan of the Chief Wahoo Logo, but I think because people don't like something or are "offended", that doesn't give them the right to tell you what to do. That's ridiculous.
Dolan is on record saying he didn't think it was offensive, but to make a deal to have the ALL STAR GAME in Cleveland, I think he gave into "phasing the chief out".
But the question is whats next? Why doesn't Kansas City get rid of the Chiefs? Atlanta rename the Braves? Washington get rid of the Redskins, and Chicago do away with the Blackhawks. Truly, all of those teams must be racist, and whatever someone else's perception of something must be more important then what the business owner, fans who pay money, or other consensus citizens think.
Also, we should do away with Columbus Day, and turn it into Indigenous People's day like they did here in Cali. Even though most Italians in New York didn't celebrate Columbus himself, but the fact that Italian Americans accomplished a lot of good in America and did a lot of good (The friction was even shown in a Sopranos Episode).
We should tear down every Robert E Lee statue, and any statue of any person that "offended" anyone, even though Statues are a reminder of history, not a celebration of that specific person.
Maybe if we don't remember the evils of history and the past, it might repeat itself? But the fact is people should have the freedom to be stupid, and to have a stupid opinion.Â
I absolutely agree with everything you say, except for the origins of Chief Wahoo.
The claim that Chief Wahoo and the Indians were named to âhonorâ Louis Sockalexis have been debunked man. Plus, the guy was a raging alcoholic who only played 94 games. On top of that, Sockalexisâ descendants donât like it either. So weâre âhonoringâ a guy whoâs family wants Chief Wahoo and the Indians name gone. Yeah, we sure honor and respect him.
The claim that Chief Wahoo and the Indians were named to âhonorâ Louis Sockalexis have been debunked man. Plus, the guy was a raging alcoholic who only played 94 games. On top of that, Sockalexisâ descendants donât like it either. So weâre âhonoringâ a guy whoâs family wants Chief Wahoo and the Indians name gone. Yeah, we sure honor and respect him.
Show me the legit source of the "debunking", because so far there is no source, its just a bogus theory that people go with to try and make their narrative sound more valid.
Dude, WTF are you smoking. Wahoo is not neimg pulled down because of lack of interest. You out of touch pimpledick. Wahoo is beong pulled because the owner is a liberal and  caved to PC.
You are 110% right. He caved to the commissioner to get the all star baseball game in Cleveland. he's 110% a weak pussy. He also is on the record saying he didn't consider Wahoo offensive and wouldn't change it at this moment when he bought the team.Â
As for the business side, it is a GREAT business move, an absolute win-win. Get rid of the controversy surrounding the logo. That increases the value of Chief Wahoo, which will still be sold as merchandise.
This is really all about Dolan playing patsy to the commissioner to seem more progressive in the "Deal" in order to have the allstar game in Cleveland. Dolan has no values.
I can tell you for a FACT, 90% of young adults, liberal or conservative, donât care if they get rid of Chief Wahoo.
Most who don't come from Cleveland don't care at all. But a lot of the people from Cleveland don't like people telling them what they can wear or what logo's they can have, because someone finds them offensive. I think people like Ghoolie, and Me, and many of my friends have problem with the lack of integrity and values of people like Dolan, who own a team, and who completely cave in to anything to get a little money (all star game) and publicity (being progressive).
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The claim that Chief Wahoo and the Indians were named to âhonorâ Louis Sockalexis have been debunked man. Plus, the guy was a raging alcoholic who only played 94 games. On top of that, Sockalexisâ descendants donât like it either. So weâre âhonoringâ a guy whoâs family wants Chief Wahoo and the Indians name gone. Yeah, we sure honor and respect him.
Show me the legit source of the "debunking", because so far there is no source, its just a bogus theory that people go with to try and make their narrative sound more valid.
Dude, WTF are you smoking. Wahoo is not neimg pulled down because of lack of interest. You out of touch pimpledick. Wahoo is beong pulled because the owner is a liberal and  caved to PC.
You are 110% right. He caved to the commissioner to get the all star baseball game in Cleveland. he's 110% a weak pussy. He also is on the record saying he didn't consider Wahoo offensive and wouldn't change it at this moment when he bought the team.Â
As for the business side, it is a GREAT business move, an absolute win-win. Get rid of the controversy surrounding the logo. That increases the value of Chief Wahoo, which will still be sold as merchandise.
This is really all about Dolan playing patsy to the commissioner to seem more progressive in the "Deal" in order to have the allstar game in Cleveland. Dolan has no values.
I can tell you for a FACT, 90% of young adults, liberal or conservative, donât care if they get rid of Chief Wahoo.
Most who don't come from Cleveland don't care at all. But a lot of the people from Cleveland don't like people telling them what they can wear or what logo's they can have, because someone finds them offensive. I think people like Ghoolie, and Me, and many of my friends have problem with the lack of integrity and values of people like Dolan, who own a team, and who completely cave in to anything to get a little money (all star game) and publicity (being progressive).
Show me the legit source of the "debunking", because so far there is no source, its just a bogus theory that people go with to try and make their narrative sound more valid.
You are 110% right. He caved to the commissioner to get the all star baseball game in Cleveland. he's 110% a weak pussy. He also is on the record saying he didn't consider Wahoo offensive and wouldn't change it at this moment when he bought the team.Â
This is really all about Dolan playing patsy to the commissioner to seem more progressive in the "Deal" in order to have the allstar game in Cleveland. Dolan has no values.
Most who don't come from Cleveland don't care at all. But a lot of the people from Cleveland don't like people telling them what they can wear or what logo's they can have, because someone finds them offensive. I think people like Ghoolie, and Me, and many of my friends have problem with the lack of integrity and values of people like Dolan, who own a team, and who completely cave in to anything to get a little money (all star game) and publicity (being progressive).
Heres one, but there are plenty. Thereâs really no way to prove it one way or the other, but when you do some digging it seems pretty apparent that the Indians name started as a derogatory nickname because we had an American Indian on our team.
Dude, Iâm with you, I think the progressive movement is so dumb when it comes to almost everything. Black shootings, abortion, trans rights... its all a Marxist leftist agenda. Iâm totally with you. But dude, this isnât some blue haired dumb white bitch saying they donât like Chief Wahoo. Itâs literally members of Indian tribes who want it gone.
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Show me the legit source of the "debunking", because so far there is no source, its just a bogus theory that people go with to try and make their narrative sound more valid.
You are 110% right. He caved to the commissioner to get the all star baseball game in Cleveland. he's 110% a weak pussy. He also is on the record saying he didn't consider Wahoo offensive and wouldn't change it at this moment when he bought the team.Â
This is really all about Dolan playing patsy to the commissioner to seem more progressive in the "Deal" in order to have the allstar game in Cleveland. Dolan has no values.
Most who don't come from Cleveland don't care at all. But a lot of the people from Cleveland don't like people telling them what they can wear or what logo's they can have, because someone finds them offensive. I think people like Ghoolie, and Me, and many of my friends have problem with the lack of integrity and values of people like Dolan, who own a team, and who completely cave in to anything to get a little money (all star game) and publicity (being progressive).
Heres one, but there are plenty. Thereâs really no way to prove it one way or the other, but when you do some digging it seems pretty apparent that the Indians name started as a derogatory nickname because we had an American Indian on our team.
Dude, Iâm with you, I think the progressive movement is so dumb when it comes to almost everything. Black shootings, abortion, trans rights... its all a Marxist leftist agenda. Iâm totally with you. But dude, this isnât some blue haired dumb white bitch saying they donât like Chief Wahoo. Itâs literally members of Indian tribes who want it gone.
But dude, this isnât some blue haired dumb white bitch saying they donât like Chief Wahoo. Itâs literally members of Indian tribes who want it gone.
I don't have as much as a problem of getting "rid of the wahoo logo" as I do "how we got rid of the wahoo logo".
Dolan did it ONLY because his boss (the comissioner) said he'd give us the allstar game.
And the problem is, is that when they see they can change things, they will constantly want more until you don't even have a right to free speech.
First they change team names, then columbus day, then you can't wear any halloween costume, you can't even be a bear for halloween because that's offensive to bears. You have to call everyone by their gender pronouns. Just because someone is offended doesn't give them the right to tell you how to act or what to do. I understand how they feel, and if the owner LEGIT wanted to do it, then why did he do it after the commissioner promised him the allstar game. Because he's a sellout and a pussy.Â
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