Freddie fired

Tacosman

@mld-woody said:

Was against the Kitchens hire

Was against the flashy trades

Smh

Gregg would have us in a better spot

Gregg as in Gregg Williams? He is a freaking laughingstock around the league and isn't a head coaching candidate.

Im no fan of FK either, but acting like Gregg freaking Williams of all people would be a better choice is bizarre. Our defense last year mostly blew goats with him. many many many years ago(like when people still bought cds) he had a couple pretty good defenses with Washington, and he is living off that(and the good ole boys network I guess) to get a job. And it only takes one. But in the right circles he is not seen as a credible DC candidate, much less HC candidate(except to make fun of)

As for the OBJ trade, you do that every time. That's why it got an A+ from virtually everyone. Giving up a mid first round pick for a top 3 wr(even though he hasn't played like a top 3 guy this year) who the other team already took some of the cap hit for? A no brainer....

bjh2130

@dutch-oven said:

I'm so conflicted on this.

I've not been a fan of what I've seen of this team, on and off the field, but I've often complained about the Browns continually changing head coaches. I don't want to fire Kitchens, but I also don't want him to continue to Retard this team's progress. I really don't see how this team has improved from this time last season, but I hate the idea of starting over again... but I hate the idea of having Kitchens still running this team next year... ugh.

I know many will disagree with this but I don't go off where we were last year to where we are this year. Last year we caught lightning in a bottle with a very easy back end schedule. For example it's very plausible we go 8-8 because of a very easy back end of the schedule after starting 2-6. That coupled with the new players we had to integrate and being a very young team that needs to learn to win and a brand new coach.....

I go off of has Freddie improved this year and learned from some of his mistakes. While he is still making quite a few mistakes he is learning from his mistakes and starting to change his ways. He's gotten much better with time management over the year. He is getting better disciplining players and just growing as a coach.

hoorta

@bjh2130 said:

I know many will disagree with this but I don't go off where we were last year to where we are this year. Last year we caught lightning in a bottle with a very easy back end schedule. For example it's very plausible we go 8-8 because of a very easy back end of the schedule after starting 2-6. That coupled with the new players we had to integrate and being a very young team that needs to learn to win and a brand new coach.....

I go off of has Freddie improved this year and learned from some of his mistakes. While he is still making quite a few mistakes he is learning from his mistakes and starting to change his ways. He's gotten much better with time management over the year. He is getting better disciplining players and just growing as a coach.

I'll grant you Freddie has been"growing' as a coach. That doesn't absolve him going into Pittsburgh with a team vastly superior in offense talent- and laying a big fat egg. And he did the same in Denver losing to a third string QB.

BTW- your top TE can be activated- but you didn't Freddie. Inquiring minds want to know why in the hell not?

Tour2ma

Freddie gets the rest of 2019 at a minimum... and likely 2020 to boot. I just hope Wilks is around in 2020 as well. Really want to see both with a little more talent at OT and LB respectively.

The ball is in Dorsey's court...

hoorta

@tour2ma said:

Freddie gets the rest of 2019 at a minimum... and likely 2020 to boot. I just hope Wilks is around in 2020 as well. Really want to see both with a little more talent at OT and LB respectively.

The ball is in Dorsey's court...

Problem there Tour, can you really pin today's loss on the o-line, or linebackers? We were up 10-0, and then collectively took a nap.

Yeah Duck got lucky on some ducks, but we failed big time to adjust to their adjustments.

Tour2ma

@hoorta said:

Problem there Tour, can you really pin today's loss on the o-line, or linebackers? We were up 10-0, and then collectively took a nap.

Not pinning anything on anything, h... just looking at the team needs.

But were I, then I could make a strong case about the OL. Once we had to pass our OL really wasn't doing the job for Baker. D-side was more about the missing DL pieces than LB.

browns52

@d-bone said:

Inexcusable. Simply awful.

he is a piece of shit hc....with no clue...

browns52

@hoorta said:

Problem there Tour, can you really pin today's loss on the o-line, or linebackers? We were up 10-0, and then collectively took a nap.

Yeah Duck got lucky on some ducks, but we failed big time to adjust to their adjustments.

the coach sucks...the opportunity came with that int in the 4th qtr....we had the fucking ball at their 30....and good hillbilly kitchens throws three times...we lost yardage and had to punt...are you fucking kidding me...you have chubb and hunt...and you throw 3 usless passes....and you think this will change in 2020 if these morons are still around...eh good luck with that....a fucking 4th string qb smacks the shit out of the clowns.knocking them out of the playoffs....a 4th string qb...if you are baltimore or pittsburgh, you are rooting that the moronic fo will keep kitchens and the rest of these bums forever....

Ibleedbrown

@tour2ma said:

Not pinning anything on anything, h... just looking at the team needs.

But were I, then I could make a strong case about the OL. Once we had to pass our OL really wasn't doing the job for Baker. D-side was more about the missing DL pieces than LB.

The defense, particularly the line, looked gassed as the game wore on. I think l mentally noted that before the first half was even over.

The Oline was terrorized much like they were the first game by Watt and company, but we just didn’t get enough magical Baker plays to pull this one out.

Tour2ma

@browns52 said:

the coach sucks...the opportunity came with that int in the 4th qtr....we had the fucking ball at their 30....and good hillbilly kitchens throws three times...we lost yardage and had to punt...are you fucking kidding me...you have chubb and hunt...and you throw 3 usless passes....and you think this will change in 2020 if these morons are still around...eh good luck with that....

Did you look at our last 6 runs? I have... 3,5,1,1,2 and 3 yards. Tretter was playing on one leg and couldn't drive block or get to the 2nd level.

Also the possession at their 30 of which you write came one play after we'd moved the ball 61 yards in 7 plays... all passes.

Put those two things together and the air looks like the better route... if you are trying to win the game.

Duckpins

The only question is what are they going to get for OBJ, a 3rd round pick and a player? And who replaces Fat Dumb Freddie? After the turnover you can't get less than a field goal attempt. Run 2 times with Hunt or Chubb. See how close you get to the 20. But Baker on 3rd and long will try to make something happen and get sacked. Bet on it.

hoorta

@duckpins said:

The only question is what are they going to get for OBJ, a 3rd round pick and a player? And who replaces Fat Dumb Freddie? After the turnover you can't get less than a field goal attempt. Run 2 times with Hunt or Chubb. See how close you get to the 20. But Baker on 3rd and long will try to make something happen and get sacked. Bet on it.

I checked, and the Browns do have an out on OBJ's contract next year. I don't understand why many on the Board are so anxious to dump him. Replace him with WHO? the triple H's? Harris, Hilliard, HIggins? A third round pick? Get real. Even with the fall off in production, OBJ is in the top 25 in the league- meaning he's still a legit #1 WR in my book.

Freddie I'm not so sure about. He needs to go 3-1 the rest of the way out to be on solid footing, and even that might not do it. Losing to the Bengals at home Sunday could be the end.

Duckpins

OBJ is not the problem. It is the dynamic he sets up with Baker hunting for him instead of the open man like last year.

hoorta

@duckpins said:

OBJ is not the problem. It is the dynamic he sets up with Baker hunting for him instead of the open man like last year.

Maybe. Him getting double covered has allowed Landry to have a career year. I rarely see Baker trying to force the ball to him anymore when he's double covered.

Icecube

@orion said:

Now that the schedule gets somewhat easier, lets fire the coach because we lost to the really good teams.

The Steelers are a "really good team?" Denver?

7moses7

@hoorta said:

I checked, and the Browns do have an out on OBJ's contract next year. I don't understand why many on the Board are so anxious to dump him. Replace him with WHO? the triple H's? Harris, Hilliard, HIggins? A third round pick? Get real. Even with the fall off in production, OBJ is in the top 25 in the league- meaning he's still a legit #1 WR in my book.

Freddie I'm not so sure about. He needs to go 3-1 the rest of the way out to be on solid footing, and even that might not do it. Losing to the Bengals at home Sunday could be the end.

Ha ha ha ha lol lol OBJ is not a top 25 WR , he isn’t a #1 on this team he plain and simply hasn’t produced like a#1 WR . Catching balls with one hand in pre game and practice isn’t producing results. All show and no go !!!!!

Orion

@icecube said:

The Steelers are a "really good team?" Denver?

You're aware that you are quoting something that was said on October 27th...right?

What I would say NOW would be, "We've lost to teams with good defensive fronts". So what does that tell us? It tells us that we have a poor OFFENSIVE front. Baker has NOT shown to play well when he lacks confidence in his OL. MOST of our OL needs to be upgraded. Now, it's not that they fuck up on every single play against good D's.....but hey, how confident would YOU be with Robinson, Kush & Hubbard pass protecting for you?

PoeticG

If you ship OBJ you might as well send Landry too, they are a packaged deal now... Landry will revolt if they give up OBJ.

PoeticG

My issues are:

1) How do you leave your best safety at home with the season on the line?

2) How do you leave your best TE out of the game when he's been eligible for 2 weeks and supposedly healthy?

3) How do you keep a gimpy Vernon in the game, he had a negative impact?

4) How do you keep a gimpy Center in the game, he had a negative impact?

5) How do you neglect to protect your QB in a game where the opposition is clearly trying to hurt him?

Hue do you think you are Freddy?

Dutch Oven

@poeticg said:

My issues are:

1) How do you leave your best safety at home with the season on the line?

2) How do you leave your best TE out of the game when he's been eligible for 2 weeks and supposedly healthy?

3) How do you keep a gimpy Vernon in the game, he had a negative impact?

4) How do you keep a gimpy Center in the game, he had a negative impact?

5) How do you neglect to protect your QB in a game where the opposition is clearly trying to hurt him?

Hue do you think you are Freddy?

1. Because your best safety apparently is a head case, who might have decided in the biggest week of the season to not bother to show up to practice. Like literally skip practice.

2. Fair question. This is as puzzling as the same scenario that played out earlier in the season with Higgins. (Which seems like was some untold discipline issue too?)

3. He played 12 plays.

4. Tretter played on one leg for half of the season last year.

5. This might be better asked to John Dorsey, who did a shitty job on the OLine last offseason.