@canton-dawg said:

Do you see franchise QB in Arch Manning?

Me neither.

I'll be honest man, there was a time where I'd follow that sort of stuff to a science. Between kids and other priorities in life my football watching time is way lower yet alone the deep dives into footwork, release angles, and all that jazz. So truthfully I have no good basis to make the answer yes or no.

All I know is the dude checks off a lot of boxes you want at the QB position and I think it made a lot of sense to go back to Texas this year. He would have for sure gone top 5 if he declared this year on potential alone. 

@canton-dawg said:

I hope not.

IF Arch comes to Cleveland, the Manning family will be welcomed with open arms and offered to buy equity in the team- I'd almost guarantee it. Easy way to drum up interest in the new stadium. See Tom Brady and the Raiders. Also makes it way less likely for him to pull an Eli to the Chargers moment.

@sdbacker80 said:

This is why there was a strong case to hold onto him.  This may shock the world but not every team can fit Myles in financially or can handle the asset departure and some aren’t at a point and time where it makes sense.  So we didn’t have 25-30 offers. 
 

You don’t get like for like with a first ballot hall of famer with prime years left.  Because you aren’t getting that player in return at a premium position. They are unicorns.

So you hope Verse becomes very good and hits double digit sack numbers and you use all these picks now to hopefully find us the best QB we’ve had since Graham or Kosar.   And the money you aren’t paying Myles you take it and spend it wisely adding some other talent.   Hopefully 4 or 5 equals 1. 

Indeed, my friend- indeed. We saw a small glimpse of Myles with competent QB play in 2019-2020 and, God willing, it would have been awesome to see that in three years with an up and coming rookie QB. Alas, three years in NFL terms may as well be a decade in others.

The other thing to remember in all of this- there was NEVER going to be a package that was fair for Myles Garrett when you really think about it. The man when it's all said and done could easily have both the highest single sack season and the all-time sack record, it addition to them already fitting his gold jacket. This is all in the context of him being in his physical prime.

I can tell you this much, though- I ain't buying a single sunday ticket package or anything other than sailing the high internet seas to watch the Browns this year. I completely understand why this happened, but it's not going to be pretty this year.

As long as there's two high round picks in addition to what is being reported, this is a great deal.

Let's face the music- this team is going to be bad until Watson is off the books. This 2026 draft was all about getting young talent some experience under their belt to get a QB in the 2027 draft. Monken screams 'one and done' coach to me personally, and if this season goes to shit no one is going to act like it's a bad decision to get a new, young coach who may actually see this team as a contender with their guy at QB. Garrett is an absolute monster and I have no doubt he will be elite for 4-5 more seasons. However, you're very likely talking about 3 years from now into that window before it maybe pays off.

That all realistically points to this being a no brainer.  Having as much ammunition for next year is just the logical end game for a guy, while historically great, is only adding 1-2 wins by his play. It sucks to lose another all timer (see Joe Thomas) who essentially didn't get to any real level of success, but that's how it goes.

Officially time to start stirring this pot:

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/48808351/why-2026-nfl-cleveland-browns-giving-deshaun-watson-chance-starting-quarterback

@ballpeen said:

Most stadiums in Florida are built to provide a shade side to the stadium. I will say a 1PM start doesn't give much advantage to either side. Shade doesn't begin to show much advantage until late in a 1PM game.

Our own stadium has a sun side, the north side to the stadium.  It's a bit of a disadvantage early in the season, but later in the season we get the sun(if any) at the time you year you want all the sun you can get.

Home teams are always going to take the side of the field that provides any edge they can get.

On that note, that is why my season tickets are on the north side of the stadium for the reason mentioned.  I was glad to see our 1st home game isn't until week three. You can bake during those first few weeks.  I have always found myself hoping for a cloudy and or rainy day for the opener. By week 3 the weather has usually shifted enough to at least provide a cooling breeze.

Sure, but Hard Rock stadium notoriously went to the extreme in this regard. Respectfully, having been on the wrong side for 1 PM at that stadium a few times there's a marked difference even at kickoff. For example, 4 years ago at kickoff there was a 30 degree difference for a 1 PM game at the start of the 2nd quarter: https://www.foxweather.com/weather-news/miami-dolphins-stadium-heat-minnesota-vikings. Mind you this was a game in mid October as well- wild.

Here's more about it: https://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2022/10/17/23408608/dolphins-shaded-sideline-temperature-reading-vikings-stadium

In any case though, I ain't sitting in that nonsense as compared to enjoying the game on TV anymore. It's just not worth to feel like I'm having a heat stroke sitting for more than 5 minutes. My entire extended family are Dolphins fans so we usually end up at a game, but not until snowbird season.

@dutch-oven said:

I don’t like going to September games in Cleveland because of the potential heat… I can’t imagine what they could be like in Florida.

Shit man, I went to the Dolphins/Browns game in mid October a few years ago and was ready to leave at halftime. and you get used to the heat- September is an absolute no-go.

If you don't know, the Dolphins stadium intentionally is built to blast the sun in the away area. You want to sit near the Browns you're in an oven.

Man, nice stretch for the players of 5 weeks of being in Cleveland including the bye. I don't know if I've ever seen that level of home games- doubt it'll matter by that point in the season but we shall see. There's game to win on that schedule for sure though.

Was hoping to go to either the Jacksonville or Tampa games but that's such a brutal time of year down here to be outside for several hours. Not to mention those two weeks are the peak of hurricane season. You'd sort of think the opposite- play up north in the early months but what do I know.

@orion said:

Apparently you aren't aware of the fact that during an interview a few months ago he told the sports world that the Watson thing was a 'Swing and a miss'.  He's already owned the situation.  Having Watson named the starter and fail would only make him and the Browns look like dingbats that are incapable of learning.  I'm sure that Haslem would like nothing more than to have space aliens come down, snatch up Watson, and take off to another galaxy.  But, he's got a new coach that just might choose him as the starter.  And he has to let that happen, if that's the way things go.

I am aware, yes. But Haslam strikes me as the kind of dude who could be sweet talked into something like this scenario "The reason Watson sucked is because of prior coaching and scheme. We got the right guys now to make it work". 

To the bolded point, Haslam and crew have already sunk to as low as possible in the whole Watson situation. If he goes out and sucks it really doesn't get much lower than what the other owners, fans, etc think. But, if on the 5% chance he does look good Haslam can say I told you so and not go down in the record books as making the stupidest trade in NFL history.

Again, I have no fucking clue what they are thinking. But giving the way the man has operated, I really don't see that as a wild thought process.

@dutch-oven said:

Monken is going to start the QB who he feels gives the Browns the best chance to win.

Organizationally though, I don't see the point. I feel like you need to have a real competition between Watson and Sanders, and if MKC is correct via her contacts in the team, Monken wants the starter named well before Training Camp. 

I just hope the Browns give Sanders a shot sometime this season to figure out if he's someone to build around or if they need to go balls-out in the '27 Draft for a QB. Depending on how they finish, that could mean they get VERY aggressive moving up for a specific QB. Future draft picks could be flying around.

To the bold- if Watson ends up being named the starter, it does also make you believe that this regime having seen the tape in more detail already feel like they have enough to know he (Sanders) is not the guy. The 'better' option in their eyes is to roll the dice one more time with Watson (which also sucks). I also would not be surprised at all if Haslam is pulling the lever to make Watson work and not go down as the owner who made the worst trade and contract in NFL history. He 110% would operate that way based on years of observations.

I'll keep it totally honest- I really don't care how this ends up. I think both are going to both stink and all eyes are having a markedly good core for a '27 rookie QB. I'd much prefer 

@dutch-oven said:

I was thinking about the OLine today, and only Fano do I feel confident will be here in three seasons. Three or four of the vets they have got this offseason and will start are pretty much stopgaps, on one or two year deals.

I can see a scenario where the Browns in next year's draft use two picks in the first four rounds on OLine again. 

true- I do like though how a rookie QB could, in theory, be behind a pretty well molded offensive line in 2027 assuming these guys don't all suck. It seems like everyone, to include Dawand Jones, that would be starting is under contract through 2027. Most of the guys are also young enough where they could in theory stick around for a few more years.

I suppose we shall see.

While building teams has to be more of a present AND future thought process, my only hope is that the Browns addressed the offensive side of the ball as much as humanly possible in the draft and FA. Last year's team had the arguably the worst OL and WR rooms in the NFL- it's much more common for bad teams rebuilding to have strong needs across both offense and defense. Not the case in Cleveland going into the offseason.

With that being said, it's solid the Browns went offense focused with the top three picks and OL in free agency. What's compelling is that if Sanders doesn't work out (which I'm not rooting for, but fully expect to have unfold), you're going to have a much improved skill position and offensive line for a rookie QB in 2027. I believe essentially every OL on the team now is locked in through at least 2027, and if Fano is who they expect him to be you also have a cornerstone at the position.

Wouldn't be upset with any of the top guys there, but I do think McDonald is going to end up as a strong player in the NFL. He showed a lot of promise as a TFL guy as almost exclusively an interior player, which is not common. It'd be a luxury pick for sure, but I also loooove having DLine depth.

I don't follow this stuff closely anymore, to be sure. There used be a time where I'd watch these nearly naked kids run fast at the combine, but those days are gone (odd to think about in that context).

I get where people are coming from with Fano, but the dude can obviously play OL at a high level. Even if OT doesn't quite pan out, if he turns into a rock on the line for the next 6-8 years while affording versatility it's a no brainer pick.  

I truly have no opinion on KC, I am just glad the organization addressed needs without overt reaches. I would have LOVED to have Downs as I truly believe he was the best player in this draft. But Fano addressed a much, much stronger concern for an offense that's been anemic for years. I understand the idea of BPA no matter what, but this offense desperately needed talent infusion in every aspect. 

I am excited to see what Monken and crew can do with Judkins and this significantly upgraded OL (on paper). I wouldn't be opposed to a RB at some point today- I like Sampson a lot, but the more talent the better.

@sdbacker80 said:

I bumped the line to -9.5.  I expected at least a two score game.

My two 'locks' were Kupp 4+ receptions and Sehawks alt spread -7.5. I was this close to just hammering those two things for roughly +300, but my dumbass added Drake Maye under 1.5 passing TDs just to get wanged at the very end. It looked so good too.

@tiamat63 said:

 The Pats have a bright future with a long window of being contenders open again.   At least, it appears that way.  Now it's on them to fix the left side of the OL (Campbell to guard?) and to make sure the skill positions are able to contend with top-tier defensive talent.  

 Not like we would know, but it isn't easy losing a SuperBowl.    N.E. can take solace in the fact that they're built to take runs at repeat appearances.  

At least next season for sure until Maye gets his bread. With that being said, we shall see how they fare playing a markedly harder schedule next season. I certainly have no doubt, though, that Maye is a "have a chance every year he's healthy" kind of QB though. 

The only interesting thought, though, is this conversation with exactly what was said with Joe Burrow after losing the Superbowl. To your point, it's hard to climb that mountain when the league is set up to have parity.

The better team won in a clear mismatch of skill- not much more to say really. Just like last year with the Chiefs, the blemishes just get exposed in these games with a clearly better squad more often than not. Not to mention, the Pats played a historically easy schedule and it all amounted to the beatdown you saw last night. 

With that being said, it is pretty funny to me people dogging Maye like he wasn't a 23 year old young dude in the biggest game there is. 

@flugel said:

jrb, we're the only fan-base that morphed into a massive support group.  

I can tell you this much man. As a 36 year old guy with a family, this was the first year I truly didn't care about being available to watch games, or otherwise watching games in less than ideal ways (on my phone at the park, following ESPN, etc). My old man gets the Sunday Ticket as a veteran for cheap ($75 for the season to split) so I keep that in full honesty for the fantasy football/ betting enjoyment I do during the season. If that goes up significantly, it's being dropped 100%

There's just no reason to care significantly- I'll always enjoy talking with fellow fans to your point, and I will always be a fan of the team. But it's just pure, straight apathy at this point. The only time I'll even consider going to a game is if they play in miami, and even then it's more so to spend time with my family and my in-laws who are dolphins fans.

@texasag1969 said:

Yeah, but this year you get to be Gene Kelly a.k.a. An American in Paris.?

To make the first game in the country that matchup certainly is something. Good thing the French are notoriously known for their generosity to outsiders, /s

@flugel said:

To the part in bold, I would love to agree with your question.  Unfortunately, the reality that there's 31 better business owners than the one we count on - my guess is Jimmy wanted a "Yes sir" to immediately deflecting any and all questions about Schwartz and especially not guaranteeing any soon to be meetings between Schwartz and Owner & FO. There's a reason there's still a dumpster fire burning because of this owner.... 

Oh yes, 100%- It's very, very obvious that Jimmy just can't stay out of the "room where it happens" to quote Hamilton. It's absolutely the reason we're in the Watson mess and this coaching search transpired the way it did. I also pretty strongly believe it's why Sanders is on this team, amongst many other bad decisions.

It's honestly wild how the Browns were a solid playoff team just 4 years ago- so much ruined by an owner who can't help himself.

I listened to the same segment and to be honest, I'm 'in the middle' of both sides. On the one hand, it's not wrong that the whole quote puts a lot more context than the quote floating around. That's just the reality of sports journalism and it's not changing.

On the other hand, would it really have been that hard to say "it's obviously a difficult situation- I plan to meet with Jim soon to consider all the options before moving forward" instead of what he said? Like I don't need Stefanski level coach speak, but there's also levels to this crap. However, that's probably what you get when you hire a 60 year old first time HC that no one else was even considering.

This whole situation reeks of a one and done coaching carousel, but maybe that's their stupid plan anyway. I'm so disenfranchised by this whole operation at this point it's hard to have anything but apathy.