Jonathan Paul Manziel

Canton Mike

@jrb12711 said:

the part about this argument I find absolutely hilarious is all you mofos talk about patience. I read crap over and over about how pettine and insert player deserve more time and we need consistency to win.Johnny had a bad game of football throwing it, but he's played 6 god damn games. Just face it, people here don't like the dude and use any reason possible to talk him down.

You know what I saw? A young QB who had a bad game-oh no! I don't think any other QB in the history of the world had a bad completion game. I'm not even on the bandwagon fully yet, but why does Johnny not deserve a chance to develop but insert player or dumb fuck Pettine does?

^^^Exactly!

Mike

Richiswhere

I watched the video a couple of times and not once did I see him drink anything.

On a side note what was that white powder stuff on the pool table?

miktoxic

i've bashed johnny pretty good in the past BUT unless there is some serious shit going on, this is nothing.

i know his passing game yesterday sucked ass but when he threw his helmet in disgust after losing a meaningless game...............well, i'll give him a pass for having a bunch of tools for friends.

he needs to enforce the jeter rules. once you come in the door you put all mobile devices in a basket. on your way out you get them back.......along with a gift basket of cookies.

Unsympathetic

@jrb12711 said:
A young QB who had a bad game-oh no!

Just like every other one of his games.

The next time he goes through a progression will be the first. He's had 2 years -- and he still can't.

He's not NFL caliber, and it won't matter how many chances he's given.

miktoxic

@jrb12711 said:

the part about this argument I find absolutely hilarious is all you mofos talk about patience. I read crap over and over about how pettine and insert player deserve more time and we need consistency to win.Johnny had a bad game of football throwing it, but he's played 6 god damn games. Just face it, people here don't like the dude and use any reason possible to talk him down.

You know what I saw? A young QB who had a bad game-oh no! I don't think any other QB in the history of the world had a bad completion game. I'm not even on the bandwagon fully yet, but why does Johnny not deserve a chance to develop but insert player or dumb fuck Pettine does?

and vice versa.

rodgers got beat by a team that will likely represent the nfc in the super bowl this year. the steelers aren't that great no matter what the talking heads say. the browns had chances to win a game against a playoff bound team, maybe spoil their trip. and bad QB play was one of the reasons the upset didn't happen.

i like his (manziel's) gumption but we'd be crucifying ANYONE with a completion percentage like that yesterday....ANYONE.

fans are fickle and i'm sure even the high and mighty on here slip up and will break out the torches and pitch forks depending on who their particular likes and dislikes are.

if i'm pitching a case for pettine (and even farmer....let them ride out their contract) then i have to say the same for manziel. another year? what the hell. it's not like we haven't been waiting how long?

next year (IMO if i had it my way) would be the make or break year of the farmer, pettine and manziel experiment in cleveland.

hoorta

Zombo said:

Aaron Rogers?

That's your comparison???

C'mon man.

This is your saddest moment.

Take some time off and think about what you just said.

We needed an NFL QB today in the 4th Q and we got a little boy.

If you want to compare Johnny's stats to Rogers, we can do that ... but ... you might wanna just take a few days off.

Z

Z, I was out for a few days visiting friends & family, and only had access to crappy hotel computers that wouldn't let me quote. Hi, I'M BACK. Regarding Rodgers- I saw those highlights last night- and it's a truism- a great NFL defense can make even the very best look like crap. I've said a couple times in the past I vividly remember a game where Lawrence Taylor & the Giants made Joe Montana look like Joe Blow in a playoff game. Rodgers DID look like crap last night, arguably worse than Manziel. Sacked 8 times with 3 fumbles.

Zombo said:

Ok good, because your little tiny NFL wannabe just went 13 for 32 in a game that really mattered.

So I take it you won't be offended if we take a flyer on the NFL prototype with a real body and an NFL arm?

Z

@tim-couch-pulls-out said:

Yeah, that game was fucking crucial. Our playoff hopes were on the line and Manziel definitely didn't have the flu, nor was he missing his top three WR's or two starting guards.

You see John Krasinski on the cover of Men's Health? We should take a flier on him too, prototypical QB size there.

He's your tiny NFL wannabe QB too. For the foreseeable future. But if you want to spank it to tall, built guys, I'm sure there's a website for you.

Tim beat me to it, Z the only thing that mattered in that game is the Browns keeping the #1 overall draft pick in play. Did Johnny play like crap? Sure did. I think it was posted in the thread he was sick. If you bothered to listen to Manziel's post game presser- it's damn obvious he was. OK, excuses aside- bad game.

I'm not ready to start the quarterback crap game yet again in 2016, sorry. Since 2007, There have been 7 true stud qbs drafted- Ryan, Flacco, Stafford, Newton, (Dalton*), Luck, and (luck out) Wilson. Only three of those went #1, Luck was a once in a generational talent everyone and their uncle knew was going to be great- he might be heading down the Tim Couch premature injury exit though.

So it seems- losing to the Squealers, we're going to have at least the #2 pick- (even beating the boogers- we'll draft no worse that fifth) it's Browns bad karma there really isn't an Andrew Luck staring us in the face. Don't forget- drafting a bum qb high (Jafattus Russell, Joey Harrington, RG Knee) will set the Browns back yet another three seasons.

Tour2ma

VesnaKociper said:
The Browns were trying to get a second, first-round pick for Joe Thomas alone, and Denver wouldn't go there.

Fixed...

D Bone

Anybody watching AJ McCarron against Denver's #1 rated defense, this is why you draft football players, and not combine boy wonders - workout warriors - who look good in shorts and a tank top. Pick guys that have proven it on film, and done so against other top competition.

"AJ's too slow, AJ's arm is too weak, AJ didn't jump high enough in the 'how high can a guy in shorts jump and swipe the little plastic thingies' drill".........

I'm so sick and tired of the Browns missing on football players because they fall in love with the latest "draft stock riser" who has long arms and can run around little plastic cones really, really, really fast.

PICK GODDAMN FOOTBALL PLAYERS THIS TIME.

Tim Couch Pulls Out

@miktoxic said:

i guess this only goes for players you like?

what about coaches?

Sure, it goes for them too.

It's why I was on Pettine's side until we lost 16 of 19. How about we give Manziel 19 starts and then let's see. Same goes for Gilbert, Erving, Shelton, and everyone else.

But no, that's too hard of a concept for a Browns fan to understand. When a player is good, he's the best in the world. When he's bad, get rid of him. All of you are hilarious.

Tim Couch Pulls Out

@d-bone said:

Anybody watching AJ McCarron against Denver's #1 rated defense, this is why you draft football players, and not combine boy wonders - workout warriors - who look good in shorts and a tank top. Pick guys that have proven it on film, and done so against other top competition.

"AJ's too slow, AJ's arm is too weak, AJ didn't jump high enough in the 'how high can a guy in shorts jump and swipe the little plastic thingies' drill".........

I'm so sick and tired of the Browns missing on football players because they fall in love with the latest "draft stock riser" who has long arms and can run around little plastic cones really, really, really fast.

PICK GODDAMN FOOTBALL PLAYERS THIS TIME.

It's not that McCarron has a plethora of offensive playmakers.

No, definitely not that. It's because he's a "football player".

Zombo

@hoorta said:

Z, I was out for a few days visiting friends & family, and only had access to crappy hotel computers that wouldn't let me quote. Hi, I'M BACK. Regarding Rodgers- I saw those highlights last night- and it's a truism- a great NFL defense can make even the very best look like crap. I've said a couple times in the past I vividly remember a game where Lawrence Taylor & the Giants made Joe Montana look like Joe Blow in a playoff game. Rodgers DID look like crap last night, arguably worse than Manziel. Sacked 8 times with 3 fumbles.

Tim beat me to it, Z the only thing that mattered in that game is the Browns keeping the #1 overall draft pick in play. Did Johnny play like crap? Sure did. I think it was posted in the thread he was sick. If you bothered to listen to Manziel's post game presser- it's damn obvious he was. OK, excuses aside- bad game.

I'm not ready to start the quarterback crap game yet again in 2016, sorry. Since 2007, There have been 7 true stud qbs drafted- Ryan, Flacco, Stafford, Newton, (Dalton*), Luck, and (luck out) Wilson. Only three of those went #1, Luck was a once in a generational talent everyone and their uncle knew was going to be great- he might be heading down the Tim Couch premature injury exit though.

So it seems- losing to the Squealers, we're going to have at least the #2 pick- (even beating the boogers- we'll draft no worse that fifth) it's Browns bad karma there really isn't an Andrew Luck staring us in the face. Don't forget- drafting a bum qb high (Jafattus Russell, Joey Harrington, RG Knee) will set the Browns back yet another three seasons.

I don't get guys that are OK with losing.

I don't understand guys that want to burn more years on Johnny Manziel.

They game "mattered" not because we were in some playoff chase ... DUH ... it mattered to Manziel because he is three games into a four game audition and he just put on a horrible display of passing in a game in which the Browns could have beaten a team that was fighting for a playoff spot in their own home in late December.

That loss is squarely on manziel, and that's not good for him. It's not good for us. And i think the game kinda mattered to the Chiefs too.

As for the flu ... when this video of him drinking, acting like an idiot and inexpicably allowing himself to be video taped in assmode one more happen? Friday? Thursday night? And then he's too sick to throw a ball on Sunday? Please.

Zombo

D Bone

@tim-couch-pulls-out said:

It's not that McCarron has a plethora of offensive playmakers.

No, definitely not that. It's because he's a "football player".

It doesn't hurt for sure, but if you can't see it, then you're even stupider than I thought........ Pretty tough to do, but if anyone can do it, it's you.

TexasAg1969

Zombo said:

I don't understand guys that want to burn more years on Johnny Manziel.

Zombo

Like these guys?

http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2015/12/cleveland_browns_veterans_go_t.html

miktoxic

@tim-couch-pulls-out said:
All of you are hilarious.

all of US??

i guess you aren't one of US (if you were.....ever)? or are you above US?

like i said in another post i'll give them all until the end of next year. problem is with manziel is he might not beat out an old man for the starting job.

that must hurt cuz we all know you hate old men, especially when they take jobs away from lazy nudnicks like you.

Canton Mike

@tim-couch-pulls-out said:

Sure, it goes for them too.

It's why I was on Pettine's side until we lost 16 of 19. How about we give Manziel 19 starts and then let's see. Same goes for Gilbert, Erving, Shelton, and everyone else.

But no, that's too hard of a concept for a Browns fan to understand. When a player is good, he's the best in the world. When he's bad, get rid of him. All of you are hilarious.

TCPO, you knew this was coming & so did I. Johnny has one stinker of a game throwing the ball this year & far too many predict he's worthless. I think the kid's a player & one lousy game doesn't change that. There is no quit in the kid as evidenced by being down 17-3 at the half & his 2nd half effort with many "Johnny Ball" highlights. IMHO, we would be wise to see Johnny through next year at the least.

Mike

Richiswhere

Zombo said:

I don't get guys that are OK with losing.

I don't understand guys that want to burn more years on Johnny Manziel.

They game "mattered" not because we were in some playoff chase ... DUH ... it mattered to Manziel because he is three games into a four game audition and he just put on a horrible display of passing in a game in which the Browns could have beaten a team that was fighting for a playoff spot in their own home in late December.

That loss is squarely on manziel, and that's not good for him. It's not good for us. And i think the game kinda mattered to the Chiefs too.

As for the flu ... when this video of him drinking, acting like an idiot and inexpicably allowing himself to be video taped in assmode one more happen? Friday? Thursday night? And then he's too sick to throw a ball on Sunday? Please.

Zombo

Doesn't Pettine get any credit for his complete waste of our 3rd time out in the 4th quarter?

D Bone

I'm just glad he isn't drinking a Zima

LondonBrown

What a nothing video, he's at home for crying out loud.

It's enough to drive you to drink all this....

Zombo

TCPO and the rest of the Manziel dick lickers are whining in the other thread because we haven't given proper thought to their list of excuses "He has no weapons, boo hoo hoo" ... "He had the sniffles" ... "Aaron Rogers had a bad game too!"

Because, well that is what pussies do. They whine and make excuses instead of maybe saying "wow, it is the end of year two and this guy's footwork is awful, he still can't read defenses or go through progressions, and he is wildly inconsistent."

So I am just wondering ... who can I compare Johnny too? How about the quarterback on the same team with the same players?

McCown 2015: 8 G, 8GS, 1-7, 63.7 comp%, 263 ypg, 4.1TD% 1.4 Int% 7.3 Sack% Rating 93.3

Manziel 2015: 10G, 6 GS, 2-4, 57.8 comp%, 150 ypg, 3.1TD% 2.2 Int% 7.9 Sack% Rating 79.4

We won't go into details on 2014, because it is too ugly, but, Hoyer 7-6, 76.5 Rating, Manziel 0-2 42.0 Rating

I assume we are OK with the "weapons" argument here, unless you think Brian Hartline and Andrew Hawkins were the very key to McCown's success. But I can hear the "experienced QB" whining, so let's look at his classmates:

OK, how about the players in the same draft class, the four QBs taken in the first 36 picks:

Blake Bortles

29 G, 28 GS, 8-20, 58.9 Cmp%, 7,097 Yards, 46 TD, 4.4 TD%, 33 INT 3.1 Int% 6.8 YPA, 244.7 YPG, 80.9 Rating

Johnny Manziel

15 G, 8 GS, 2-6, 57.0 Cmp%, 1,675 Yards, 7 TD, 2.7 TD%, 7 INT 2.7 Int% 6.5 YPA, 111.7 YPG, 74.4 Rating

Teddy Twatwater

28 G, 27 GS, 16-11, 65.2 Cmp%, 6,051 Yards, 28 TD, 3.4 TD%, 20 INT 2.4 Int% 7.3 YPA, 216.1 YPG, 88.0 Rating

Derek Carr

31 G, 31 GS, 10-21, 59.4 Cmp%, 7,063 Yards, 52 TD, 4.6 TD%, 24 INT 2.1 Int% 6.2 YPA, 227.8 YPG, 83.9. Rating

Let's see ... They are ALL better at comp %, TD%, and passer rating ... but they aren't even close in rehab stints, lying about their whereabout and douchebag videos.

Now comes the "weapons" whining, those loaded teams Carr and Bortles inherited. Plus these guys got to start right away, they didn't have to beat out the likes of career backups Hoyer and McCown.

So ... how about just guys with more similar experience to Johnny?

Johnny Manziel

15 G, 8 GS, 2-6, 57.0 Cmp%, 1,675 Yards, 7 TD, 2.7 TD%, 7 INT 2.7 Int% 6.5 YPA, 111.7 YPG, 74.4 Rating

Marcus Marriota

12 G, 12 GS, 3-9, 62.2 Cmp%, 2,818 Yards, 19 TD, 5.1 TD%, 10 INT 2.7 Int% 7.6 YPA, 234.8 YPG, 91.5 Rating

Oh, those loaded Titans ... but Marriota was a Top 2 Pick, how about a second rounder with similar experience?

Johnny Manziel

15 G, 8 GS, 2-6, 57.0 Cmp%, 1,675 Yards, 7 TD, 2.7 TD%, 7 INT 2.7 Int% 6.5 YPA, 111.7 YPG, 74.4 Rating

Brock Osweiler

19 G, 5 GS, 3-2, 59.8 Cmp%, 1,595 Yards, 9 TD, 3.7 TD%, 4 INT 1.6 Int% 6.5 YPA, 183.9 YPG, 84.9 Rating

But, but, but ... he's been in the league longer, more camps, more time to "season", better team ...

That what pussies do, they make excuses.

No one will be a valid comparison for them.

Because they can't just look at the guy and go "Boy he's not too good, he's still not getting it, and with his size and potential for off-field problems ... we should probably flush this experiment right now and find a better prospect. Like these other guys. They come in to the league every year. We have high draft picks. Take another shot. Improve the rest of the team, bring in another prospect ... that's what you do. You don't plan on starting this guy next year. You plan on improving the position.

Zombo

Zombo

@texasag1969 said:

Like these guys?

http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2015/12/cleveland_browns_veterans_go_t.html

Donte Whitner?

Ya, like him.

Not sure he will be around to see Johnny's replacement though.

Zombo