@browns149 said: I still hate the stoolers more. The hatred goes back to the 70’s for me. The raturds are above the bungles in divisional hatred. But the stoolers still top the list for me I thought I hated the Steelers the most. Then the Rats played Pitt in the AFC title game. I couldn't believe it, I wasn't rooting for Pitt, but I definitely wanted the Rats to lose. Lesser of 2 evils I suppose. Hate list: 1a Balt 1b Pitt 1c BenGals 4 Broncos 5 Titans ( nee Oilers) 6 thru 9 NFC East ( over exposed) and Philly disrespected Paul Brown in 1950 10 Green Bay 11 LA/St Louis/LA Rams 12 Colts (Dungy rested his regulars) 13 Dolphins ( 1972, 1985 we blew both playoff games) Ok, I'm getting fired up. Damnit I hate Mondays after a Browns loss?

@lodilobo said: Vinnie was terrible when he came into the NFL. Once Parsons and Bellichik got him, he turned things around. Yes...he was not very bright. Josh  Yeah because they shortened the field for Vinnie and wouldn't let him hit anything down the middle and routed everything to the perimeter for him..... Also... The biggest knock on Vinny was he was a poor student of the game... the biggest knock by his own coaches was he did not take well to doing film study in college.. He was more interested in bangin chicks than studying film...... But He was a a good lookin kid... so there's that..

This offensive play calling rankings was from October of 2021..  https://www.yardbarker.com/nfl/articles/ranking_the_offensive_play_caller_for_each_nfl_team/s1__35857394#slide_2 Would Kevin Stefanski's, season ending play calling ranking fall above Pat Shurmur's ? 

@nickers said: I have always HATED this song... GAH!! What a ray of sunshine this guy is, folks.

@hoorta said: Speaking of- teams that are locked into a playoff spot will probably rest their starters like the Steelers. I doubt Mahomes will play more than a couple of series, if at all. Be interesting to see how the  Bills will play it against the  Dolphins.  KC's is the most interesting decision. If they rest starters this week, then with the 1st-round bye they won't see any live-game action for two weeks. Teams have had issues simply coming off a bye going into the playoffs. I think I'd give the any starters who are healthy a couple series.

@lodilobo said: I've opined from every angle since '99 about this team, and I'm now at a complete loss. I have no idea what to change. They've changed players, coaches, and even owners with absolutely no significant improvement. The, team still doesn't catch the ball well, doesn't tackle well, doesn't stop the run well, doesn't defend the pass well, etc. Please explain how in Hell do you not have a pretty good team, after loading up with talent like they did last year, improving on that, then hiring a coach who is respected and obviously ( to me, anyway ) knows what he's doing? Aside from all the crap about no preseason games, limited practice, a new offensive system, a few injuries, blah, blah, blah....what can you blame this on? When you come up with the answer for this, then answer this...Why is it..... it doesn't matter who the Ratbirds put out there on the field...they are always contenders? If we would have drafted Lamar Jackson, he would out of football by now. The colors. It's the team colors. Something brighter or darker or more striking in some way. Plus better designs for the helmets.

@dutch-oven said: I just don't see Freddie getting fired after one season, especially if they finish 8-8 or 9-7. Not saying he's done a good job, because he hasn't, but he's getting another season at least IMO.  Well....I am of the opinion that the Browns have closed whatever player talent gap may have existed between them and the Spermsuckers and the Ratfuckers.....(except maybe in a couple of spots).    But they have definitely NOT  closed the gap much more than a scintilla  when it comes to coaching talent......and that is with the acknowledgement that the former HC is the worst in the history of the NFL  where the HC was not also the owner of the team. 

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2019/09/20/browns-promote-a-cornerback-from-practice-squad/ Not good.

@texasag1969 said: Smart ones "Smart" is not a number...

@bjh2130 said: Njoku peppers Mayfield ward Garrett. In that order. The joke is definitely showing signs of Coleman disease. If he doesn't start hanging on to everything in sight, he's a goner.

@medicineman said: I just think it is bs tht refs can pick and choose on when and what to call. They control the game and the never call the other team for those hits or even PI  I know, look how many time they fined Harrison and yet didn't call the penalty too.  Goodells gay league.

@edwardejw said: You children. I guess history was not the strong suit of many of you. On January 12, 1946, Dan Reeves was denied a request by the other National Football League (NFL) owners to move his team, the Cleveland Rams to Los Angeles and the then-103,000-seat Los Angeles Memorial Coliseum.[1] Reeves threatened to end his relationship with the NFL and get out of the professional football business altogether unless the Rams transfer to Los Angeles was permitted.[1][2][3] A settlement was reached and, as a result, Reeves was allowed to move his team to Los Angeles. Been there, done that! Know all about it. Not gonna happen. That is more analogous to the Modell situation. But, in that case....the city did not fight to keep the team....and there was no ironclad lease. The city knew that it was getting a Paul Brown run organization to replace the Rams. And that team's owner knew the handwriting on the wall when he knew PB was coming to town. So he skedaddled. Good move for him? Sure, probably. And as far as I am concerned, the Rams should probably have always stayed in LA.

@lodilobo said: @the-gipper said: @lodilobo said: My point is that the individuals picking the incompetent coaches and assistants we have witnessed for the last 20 years are just lazy, freeloading losers themselves, with no clue regarding the qualities needed to coach in the NFL. Now...I would think the 2 ownerships we have seen would have had the wherewithall to accomplish such a simple task, or at least through dumb luck, by this time, hit a winner. You would think that.....and don't be coy.....name names. One was Mike Holmgren. Who else woule you put on the lazy freeloader list? Phil Savage, Mike Lombardi, are a couple who come to mind. I don't think Savage was a lazy freeloader. He was young and upcoming out of the Ravens organization that had been making all the right moves. He just didn't work out. Lombardi though.....yep. Of course, I would be wrong about that. Apparently it's a situation where, as others have eluded to, that the decision makers within the organization feel that they are much smarter than the competition, so rather than make obvious choices, they tend to make a choice not so obvious, thinking they will be proclaimed geniuses...seeing something others did not. I am trying to think who those "obvious choices" for either GM or HC would have been that our FOs did not hire. Again....please illuminate. In this statement I was referring to making draft choices and free agent choices. We passed on Clay Mathews, even though, for me, it was a no brainer, given the fact his Dad played here. We picked Johnny Manziel, when there were numerous better choices at qb, and literally any other position. I know this is all hind sight, and you never know how a player will work out in the NFL, but why not go with a player who the expert evaluators agree on? Why do we always look for the "dark horse"? Well, CMIII was a very late first round pick....so apparently not all the expert evaluators agreed on him.......and a number of our picks WERE agreed by all the experts to be rock solid. You know, like TR, Mingo, et al. So, total agreement on quality by experts is no sure proof that someone will be good. We're still waiting for that scenario to play out. The solution, in my opinion, would be to build management / coaching with successful NFL people. It's been done in Denver, Pittsburg, and many other teams. It's proven, that winners breed winners. I always mention Kosar, because 30 years ago, he set the NFL on fire with his actions on the field...not with his athletic qualities, but with a strong arm, and mostly his intellect. Why has the ownership never tried to benefit from his NFL experience, and wiining mentality? The younger fans consider him to be a drunk, drug addict, stupid, whatever. I just write that off as ignorance, because they didn't witness what he could do as a player. Whether it would be Bernie, or someone else....this ownership needs to get someone with real NFL experience / knowledge to guide these players. Well, Holmgren had all the credentials that you would want......SB winning coach with Packers. Took Seahawks to another SB. Hard to beat that. I mean....maybe they should hired Nick Saban 10 years ago....before he even went to Alabama. But what would you do now....besides hire Bernie? I would try to find a proven winner to be the GM....not a Holgren type...a currently unemployed veteran coach or GM ,who wants a challenge. Someone who has Cleveland ties. Ernest Byner?...Holmgrem obviously was a mistake. I didn't like it from the beginning, but who would have thought he was the swindler he was? We have a guy: Kuharich who kinda fits that bill. He did the fill in for Farmer while on suspension. The talent level on this team is not nearly as bad as most believe. I think Brian Hoyer proved that last season before things turned to crap. I agree completely However...this whole coaching staff is incompetent, in my opinion. Pettine has lost the team, and most of them are just going through the motions for a paycheck. Welcome to another 3 -13 season. I am not sure the whole group is so bad. But at least the DC is imo. Who looks good in the 2016 draft? I started a whole thread on that call The Final Solution.....go there and see the replies.

VesnaKociper said:I remember reading the story in the PD where Art Fell and got a scrape on his scrotum. I remember Art Fell... back-up CB in '67...

That's an excellent deal! Damn!...I wish I wouldn't have spent it on that parking lot scam.

There will come a time and place when there will be a winning football team on the shores of Lake Erie, and although some might say "As long as we win I could care less what our name or colors are" (something I have even said from time to time) that is total bull shit...there is NO way any Browns fan would not die a little inside if that were not the Browns hoisting up a super bowl trophy for the city of Cleveland. I am part of the generation of fans that has not seen a winner, being 30 years old my browns memories are of the drive, fumble, move and the horrors of 99 and on...I do not want the "Cleveland Buzzards" or "Cleveland Walleye" or whatever name they will come up with to win...I want to see the Cleveland Browns win, like my grandfather did, like my dad did. Its legacy is a connection to a past that I can only hear or read about. If they ever do change it I will still be a fan of course (go Cleveland) but when they win, what was the "Browns" will only be remembered as a contrast to that success, which would not cure any heartbreak- only validate that the "Browns" were worth giving up on...and let me be one "young" Browns fan that says...SCREW THAT GO BROWNS!

@miktoxic said: man i'm looking like the amazing kresking right now. ghoulie hated holgren and heckert months ago. then after the draft got on board and actually backed holmgren and heckert in posts before haslam bought the team. as sonn as that was announced we got this: so does your good friend actually know football or base his statements to conform to the masses? Bingo. It's not the first time he has completely changed his opinion and it won't be the last. As for Rich, I swear he cheers harder for Ghoolie than he does for his beloved Steelers..

Holmgren should take two weeks off.. And then quit

so, in reading another board, i stumbled onto a thread where the following was mentioned.....wanna see what comes to mind when you read this section taken from: http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2011/10/despite_dreams_of_making_big_p.html Cribbs on his score: Josh Cribbs finally talked McCoy into a pass against split-safety coverage -- and it went for the 45-yard touchdown. "I was asking for it all game," said Cribbs. "I told that the coverage they were playing, they were not getting wide enough on his cover 2. All game I told Colt, 'trust me!' And he said, 'if I throw it over, you better catch it.' It was really dramatic at that point. "I said, 'if you throw it over there, I'm going to score!' And he did. He had faith in me. Even though I wasn't his first read, he threw it to his playmaker. I commend him for that." McCoy admitted Cribbs wasn't in the progression against that defense, but once he launched the ball, "I thought it was a touchdown."

@dawgtracker said:I hate to admit it but I agree 100%. The goal is to win the game and chad is a distraction to achieving that goal. He is a great route runner who could probably help our receivers learn the position better but all of his characteristics outweigh the good he might bring. Exactly.. His antics and distractions are not worth the talent he brings. Plus, he is 32 years old. How many good years does he have left?